EU Hydrogen economy/power scam

[Haenk]

Could you provide a source for your claim of the forging of documents, please? If you think that one of your links is a source that substantiates this claim, could you please specify which one and where it supports this claim (possibly just quote the relevant section)?

This has been greatly discussed in german media like a couple of weeks ago.
Essentially, the ministry misquoted power companies statements of the future use of nuclear plants. The choice of words and leaving out parts (or even that selective choice of text) might turn a statement by 180 degrees.
AFAIR their statement went from "due to the scheduled going dark process, revision work and recertification will be needed to keep the plants running" to a statement by the ministry like "the industry said it's not possible to keep the plants running".
Which is IMHO a blatant lie.

Nähere Informationen auf Deutsch:
https://www.cicero.de/themen/atomausstieg

(Nevertheless, I think the exit from nuclear power was the right idea, but the execution was the worst possible. And I would blame pretty much all parties for this - CDU/SPD for sabotaging regenerative energy production and now SPD/Grüne for making a crazy mess out of everything)

[ksjh]

Nähere Informationen auf Deutsch:
https://www.cicero.de/themen/atomausstieg

I would take all this information with a grain of salt. Cicero lost a lawsuit, after which one would be basically allowed to say that they "added fictional information" in their articles after a web site published a fact check:
https://www.volksverpetzer.de/faktencheck/habeck-rechte-pseudo-skandal-akw-files/

[zilp]

This has been greatly discussed in german media like a couple of weeks ago.

No, it hasn't been. I am aware of the Cicero story, but forgery of documents was never even an accusation that was made in that context, so that can't be it.

Essentially, the ministry misquoted power companies statements of the future use of nuclear plants. The choice of words and leaving out parts (or even that selective choice of text) might turn a statement by 180 degrees.

That is not forgery of documents (Urkundenfälschung). Forgery of documents is a crime, specifically the crime of presenting a document as being authored or signed in the form presented by an entity that did not in fact author or sign that document as presented. Authoring a document and putting into it an incorrect or misleading quote of some other party's statement is not document forgery, and also not a crime in itself.

AFAIR their statement went from "due to the scheduled going dark process, revision work and recertification will be needed to keep the plants running" to a statement by the ministry like "the industry said it's not possible to keep the plants running".
Which is IMHO a blatant lie.

First of all, this is all about contents of internal documents of the government, so it is kinda misleading to say "statement by the ministry". Mind you, Cicero had to sue to force the ministry to hand over the documents. Primarily, this is about documents prepared by the ministry for consumption by the minister. In this case, the document apparently was also shared with another ministry (authored in the Bundesministerium für Wirtschaft und Klimaschutz, shared with Bundesumweltministerium, because the latter is responsible for nuclear safety, both led by green ministers, with the documents being edited by people within the ministry who were essentially hired by the minister).

And also, my understanding is that the changes that were made in the editing process that apparently were the basis for the accusation made by Cicero were completely trivial and in no way made the text misleading. Actually, it seems almost as if the whole basis for the accusation is a misunderstading of the original text by Cicero. With the "text" being changed also apparently being primarily a heading.

Nähere Informationen auf Deutsch:
https://www.cicero.de/themen/atomausstieg

I think this analysis of the case is worth a read:

https://www.volksverpetzer.de/faktencheck/habeck-rechte-pseudo-skandal-akw-files/

[wraper]

No, it hasn't been. I am aware of the Cicero story, but forgery of documents was never even an accusation that was made in that context, so that can't be it.

It was. They either suppressed expert assessments or manipulated them by changing the conclusion that nuclear power plants can continue operating safely to the opposite.

[coppice]

Yes, just let me know one thing from the EU that is not dumb and a scam, though, I'm still looking.

When the EU has done low level things, like sponsoring common standards across Europe for things like cellular and digital TV, they have a pretty good track record. When they do more public facing things the peacocks need to strut, and the efficacy of what they are strutting about is largely irrelevant. This is true everywhere, but the EU accentuates it by a greater level of disconnect from the discipline of elections.

[coppice]

Remember, Ammonia is just 3 Hydrogen atoms bonded to a central nitrogen atom.  IE: Ammonia is a hydrogen fuel without any carbon.  This chemically concentrates the hydrogen into a smaller volume with a lower pressure boiling point.  25psi for liquid Ammonia at room temp.  That's the same pressure as what's in your car tires to get ammonia all the way down to a liquid.  The issue is that the bond to nitrogen is strong and burning ammonia happens slowly at typical ICE piston compression levels with natural aspiration.

Ammonia has a lot going for it, but to be clean you do need to use it in ways that don't result in a lot of nasty nitrogen based side products. I don't see enough written about that issue in texts about ammonia powered ICEs, fuel cells, etc. If its pretty much a non-issue for some modes of consuming ammonia I would expect their proponents to be shouting about it.