EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope

[simone.pignatti]

mso5072 is $909, and mso5074 is $999
problem: the 4 channels options is at $399 !

Completely retarded pricing, why bother?

schools and universities (education, not research) are still looking for 2 channels, I fully understand the very small price difference but they have to fight against budget and saving some dollars always helps.
then if the point is why Rigol has not set the price of the MSO5074 at 909 - this I don't know.

[NivagSwerdna]

And here come the flood of Youtube comments saying this scope isn't even remotely "low cost" at $909, and is in fact way overpriced and un-affordable. From people with $1k iPhones in their pocket no doubt

No need to get arsey.  I have an android phone... and yes $909 is pushing it. As a hobbist up to $500 is more my budget.... might stretch to $700 if I keep my expenses quiet  I have been looking for a 4CH scope for ages so maybe this will get discounted after a while and move it into my price range.

[EEVblog]

And here come the flood of Youtube comments saying this scope isn't even remotely "low cost" at $909, and is in fact way overpriced and un-affordable. From people with $1k iPhones in their pocket no doubt

No need to get arsey.

Yes, there is. I can't put "low cost" in the title without getting hammered for it.
Scopes under $1k have always been in the "low cost" category, starting with 20MHz dual channel analog scopes 30 years ago, and even before that.
A lot of people can't/don't read descriptions and go in with some bias that it's got to be under $300 or $400 or $500, or insert their own budget here.

[Towger]

Dave,

In the start of your video it look like the top right part of the case does not fit together properly?

[EEVblog]

In the start of your video it look like the top right part of the case does not fit together properly?

Looks fine to me, probably the camera angle.

[Fungus]

350MHz BW is not very popular, if needed many move to the 500MHz.

I'm tempted to agree with that. If you really need 350MHz then you likely really need 350MHz, and you are in the 500M-1GHz class instruments.

Above 350MHz you need active probes, etc. I imagine that's why there's a 350MHz option - you can just about use ordinary probes there.

[Fungus]

Isn't that the reason why all Rigol scopes were interesting to begin with

Yep.

A fully optioned DS1054Z would cost $1000+ - nobody would buy it.

For $350+riglol? It's a bargain.

[station240]

Price list based on the list from Dave's video, and various bits of info from Rigol's website.
Yes the digital inputs are an option you have to pay extra for.

Code: [Select]

Rigol MSO5000
MSO5072 $909  2 channel, 70MHz
MSO5074 $999  4 channel, 70MHz
MSO5102 $1409 2 channel, 100MHz
MSO5104 $1499 4 channel, 100MHz
MSO5204 $2609 4 channel, 200MHz
MSO5304 $3999 4 channel, 300MHz

PLA2216 $399 Digital Logic Input cables

Software options
BND   $699 PWR, AWG all serial decode options

AWG   $269 Dual-channel 25 MHz Arbitrary Waveform Generator
COMP  $299 PC serial bus trigger and analysis (RS232/UART)
EMBD  $299 Embedded serial bus trigger and analysis (I2C, SPI)
AUTO  $299 serial bus trigger and analysis (CAN, LIN)
FLEX  $299 FlexRay serial bus trigger and analysis (FlexRay)
AUDIO $299 Audio serial bus trigger and analysis (I2S)
AERO  $299 MIL-STD-1553 serial bus trigger and analysis (MIL-STD-1553)
PWR   $299 Power Analysis. Ripple and Power Quality measurement.
RM    $299 Rack Mount kit
FPC   $79  Front Panel Cover

Lets say I decided to get what I need, and nothing else.
70MHZ 4 channels $999, digital inputs $399, AWG and two serial options (cheaper to get the bundle) $699.
total price US$2,097, looks even worse given the crap currency conversion to Australia Dollar.

Yeah low cost my butt.
Maybe the engineers see this as cheap, the hobbyists and people who have to justify expenses with the boss/wife see this for what it is.
It may be cheap for a 4 channel scope, but the addons are still silly pricing.

Now if they'd managed to actually include the digital inputs in the base price it's might be worth considering.
As it stands, it's much the same sort of pricing as usual, just less.

[EEVblog]

Lets say I decided to get what I need, and nothing else.
70MHZ 4 channels $999, digital inputs $399, AWG and two serial options (cheaper to get the bundle) $699.
total price US$2,097, looks even worse given the crap currency conversion to Australia Dollar.

Yeah low cost my butt.
Maybe the engineers see this as cheap, the hobbyists and people who have to justify expenses with the boss/wife see this for what it is.

They didn't design it for the low end hobbyists, it's designed to compete against the 4-5 other competing 70-300MHz MSO models.
That's why they still sell the 1054Z.

It may be cheap for a 4 channel scope, but the addons are still silly pricing.

If all you want is a 4CH scope, then no, it's not cheap, it's twice the price of what you need to pay to get a 4CH scope.

Now if they'd managed to actually include the digital inputs in the base price it's might be worth considering.
As it stands, it's much the same sort of pricing as usual, just less.

Does every scope release have to be ground breaking on price and helping push the race to the bottom?

[bd139]

I think the price is quite reasonable. SME class business this is pocket change for equipment.

[tocsa120ls]

Yeah, the two channel one is a definite no-no.

As a side note, I finally fixed my 453A, thanks for the thumbs up, Dave  When the proper replacement parts arrive (I had to series two Z-diodes and piggyback an 5x20 onto an 6x32mm fuse) I'll write a short story in the Repair section.

[rjp]

 To be fair to the whingers if these are low price then the usual rigol/siglent ones need to be called ultra mega low turbo

[Hydrawerk]

What is the real waveform update rate of MSO5000?

[Hydrawerk]

This Rigol MSO5000 has a rather cheap internal metalwork. The PSU is not impressive. I still do not like CapXon capacitors.
Look at this scope from Hameg / Rohde&Schwarz. There is no durable metal case inside, but the PSU is well built. https://youtu.be/q_FBwu2K7j0?t=710
When this scope sits on your bench without impacts or so, it might last for ages.

[TK]

Online documentation:

Datasheet: https://www.instrumentcenter.se//50.0.1.0/5407/download_10374.php

User Guide: https://www.instrumentcenter.se//50.0.1.0/5407/download_10375.php

Programming Guide: https://www.instrumentcenter.se//50.0.1.0/5407/download_10376.php

[Mr. Scram]

To be fair to the whingers if these are low price then the usual rigol/siglent ones need to be called ultra mega low turbo

Sounds about right.

People also can't stop themselves from complaining when Keysight or Keithley calls a multimeter affordable.

[TK]

I still see lots of lags in the UI compared to Keysight

[0xdeadbeef]

I wonder if the "free bundle option" will also apply for the MSO5000. Anyway, as usual, the pricing goes up much to steep for higher frequencies.
And, well, leaving out that auto-probe connectors is somewhat shabby (but the same with R&S RTB, Agilent DSOX2000 etc.).
I actually do like the black "color" (yeah, yeah, it's not really a color) though. One reason I like Lecroy

[simone.pignatti]

I wonder if the "free bundle option" will also apply for the MSO5000. Anyway, as usual, the pricing goes up much to steep for higher frequencies.
And, well, leaving out that auto-probe connectors is somewhat shabby (but the same with R&S RTB, Agilent DSOX2000 etc.).
I actually do like the black "color" (yeah, yeah, it's not really a color) though. One reason I like Lecroy

LeCroy is now light grey with black badges lol

[dr.diesel]

Rigol did not support the 4000 or 6000 series, no reason to think they will here either.   

Obviously if hackable the value is superb, but otherwise I fail to see why anyone would purchase this.

[MrMobodies]

uBoot output:

Code: [Select]

U-Boot 2014.01.Rigolee.dirty (2018.06.12 - 12:12:01)

Memory: ECC disabled
DRAM:  448 MiB
NAND:  OnDie ECC supported, 1024 MiB

zynq-edac f8006000.ps7-ddrc: ecc not enabled



Has that actually got ECC memory but they disabled it?

[johnlsenchak]

I  like the thermal  compound  oozing  out , under  the heat sink  of   the  acquisition   integrated  circuit 

[Fungus]

Obviously if hackable the value is superb, but otherwise I fail to see why anyone would purchase this.

There's no reason they can't sell this for $999, let people hack it, still make a ton of money. AS Dave says, their only problem will be manufacturing enough of them.

If they're smart they could make it so it's easy to hack the bandwidth/serial decoders but not easy to hack the signal generator.

[mrpackethead]

Is it hackable?

[scopeman]

woohoo! individual channel controls!

And a single (multiplexed) cursor control knob...wah..wah..wah.

Once you have them you will never go back.

Sam
W3OHM