Another DS1052E thread

[SuperMiguel]

So is the DS1052E really the best scope for the price?

Looking for a good scope in the $500 range. Im an EE student and i want it to last for my entire studies.

[tecman]

Unless you are getting into something exotic (very HF, for example), the Rigol is a super scope for any student.  Anything you would be doing should easily fall within the 50 or 100 MHz frequency range.  It has a descent UI and is reasonably well built, and is quite portable.  Another consideration should be a used Tektronix 22XX or 23XX family, analog scope.  You can get by for under $ 200.  They are bigger, but good performers, reliable and a very good value used.  They lack some of the modern cursors and math, but you will likely learn more using them.  I still use my older analog scopes 80% of the time, and fire up the digital when I need something more specialized.  Remember that the world ran mostly w/o digital scopes until the 1980s, and many things were invented, developed, tested and troubleshot usiny them.

paul

[SuperMiguel]

well i have an Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope but i find it really big i wanted something a bit smaller .. So you are saying that im better off with my Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope than the rigol one?

[tecman]

well i have an Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope but i find it really big i wanted something a bit smaller .. So you are saying that im better off with my Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope than the rigol one?

Don't get me wrong, the Rigol is a nice unit.  However when I think of students, an extra $500 is usually not in the budget.  If you have a 2225 and an extra $500, go for it.

paul

[SuperMiguel]

well i have an Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope but i find it really big i wanted something a bit smaller .. So you are saying that im better off with my Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope than the rigol one?

Don't get me wrong, the Rigol is a nice unit.  However when I think of students, an extra $500 is usually not in the budget.  If you have a 2225 and an extra $500, go for it.

paul

so is it worth it? Whats the benefit of the rigol one on top of my yek?

[tecman]

well i have an Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope but i find it really big i wanted something a bit smaller .. So you are saying that im better off with my Tektronix 2225 Oscilloscope than the rigol one?

Don't get me wrong, the Rigol is a nice unit.  However when I think of students, an extra $500 is usually not in the budget.  If you have a 2225 and an extra $500, go for it.

paul

so is it worth it? Whats the benefit of the rigol one on top of my yek?

Advantages:  Cursors with direct readout
                   Advanced/Auto setup and triggering
                   Math functions/FFT
                   Storage, saving to file and printing screen displays
                   Good for slow events

Disadvantages:  Aliasing
                      Vertical resolution sometimes limited (jagged)
                      High speed events (pulses, etc) sometimes hard to capture
                      Occasionally changing vert res or horiz time results in a 1 or 2 sec delay for display

Both analog and digital have their advantages.  Really good (and expensive) digitals come close to analogs in most apps.  IMO for repetitive signals I still like analog for a number of uses.

paul
 

[alm]

The Instek GDS-1062A and the Hantek/Tekway scopes tinhead wrote a lot about appear to be superior scopes to the Rigol DS1xx2E to me, although I haven't seen them in the flesh.

Agreed with tecman, an analog scope is superior to a DSO (especially a low-end one) for some work. Noise also tends to be lower in a good analog scope. Keep in mind that those Tektronix analog scopes were professional mid to high-end scopes in their time, the Rigol DSO's have never been anything but low-end scopes for service/education/hobby.

Main advantages of DSO in my mind are storage (better at slow sweep speeds, low duty cycle or single shot) and convenience (automated measurements, cursors and saving data to your computer can be very handy).

[SuperMiguel]

Lol now wondering if I should get it ...

[EEVblog]

If you only have to have ONE, you'd be foolish not to have the Rigol.
Single shot storage capability offered by DSO's is a massive advantage you would not want to be without.

Dave.

[SuperMiguel]

If you only have to have ONE, you'd be foolish not to have the Rigol.
Single shot storage capability offered by DSO's is a massive advantage you would not want to be without.

Dave.

Well i guess i can keep both of them i just dont use my tek much thats why i was wondering

also before i purchase the rigol should i look at something else, like another scope? around the same $500 range?

also i get it for $359 because of the student discount (http://www.tequipment.net/RigolEDUPromo.html)

umm nvm still $399 wonder why they dont give the %10 off :S WTH

[updatelee]

I use that long storage mem all the time. Works great for analyzing bursts of data. Like diseqc etc

[Mechatrommer]

i just dont use my tek much thats why i was wondering

i suspect will be the same fate with your newly bought dso.

imho, the main thing is whats common to all oscilloscope, ie analyzing circuit, oscillation etc, apart from special/unique differences between brands/models as others mentioned, which i think are just small aspects from what an oscilloscope really is. if you are me, i'll keep the $500, or buy other gear or date a woman etc and put the tek in good use, but then again, you are not me

ps: memory length is not really my bottleneck in works i've done so far. so i'm still not addicted by it. but its truly a wonderful feature, if... you are really need for it and put it to good use, just as the other additinal features.

[EEVblog]

The small footprint alone is often a deal clincher.
Once you get used to used to just plonking that small DSO anywhere on the bench and moving it around with ease taking it "to the job" rather than brining the job to your scope, it becomes invaluable.

Dave.

[SuperMiguel]

The small footprint alone is often a deal clincher.
Once you get used to used to just plonking that small DSO anywhere on the bench and moving it around with ease taking it "to the job" rather than brining the job to your scope, it becomes invaluable.

Dave.

is $399 the cheapest i can get this from a "US" retailer?

[tinhead]

all depends on your budget:

if you can spend 1200$ buy Agilent DSOX2002A (800x480 8.5" screen, 50000 wfms/s, 70MHz bw, 2GSs, 100kpts)
- and don'T try to hack anything

if you can spend 600$ but Hantek DSO5062B or Tekway DST1062B. They physically same devices,
offering more value for money (800x480 7" screen, 2500 wfms/s, 60MHz bw, 1GSs, 1Mpts)
- and hack to 200MHz bw is you wish.

if you can't spend that "much" money, but a Rigol DS1052E (320x240 5.7" screen, ~800 wfms/s, 50MHz bw, 1GSs, 1Mpts)
- and hack to 100MHz bw if you wish.


You can of course combine and buy e.g. Rigol + old 100Mhz Analog scope, depends on your needs and desk space.

[SuperMiguel]

all depends on your budget:

if you can spend 1200$ buy Agilent DSOX2002A (800x480 8.5" screen, 50000 wrfm/s, 70MHz bw, 2GSs, 100kpts)
- and don'T try to hack anything

if you can spend 600$ but Hantek DSO5062B or Tekway DST1062B. They physically same devices,
offering more value for money (800x480 7" screen, 2500 wrfm/s, 60MHz bw, 1GSs, 1Mpts)
- and hack to 200MHz bw is you wish.

if you can't spend that "much" money, but a Rigol DS1052E (320x240 5.7" screen, ~800 wfrm/s, 50MHz bw, 1GSs, 1Mpts)
- and hack to 100MHz bw if you wish.


You can of course combine and buy e.g. Rigol + old 100Mhz Analog scope, depends on your needs and desk space.

Well i dont mind spending $600 how much better are those (Hantek DSO5062B or Tekway DST1062B) compared with the ds1052E??

[tinhead]

there are some common things for both like available triggers, measure presets (however Hantek/Tekway added some additions in latest fw), csv exports/imports, ref and setups, PASS/FAIL, digital filters, recorder - so let's focus on diffs:

- 7" display, on Rigol 5.7"
- 800x480 resulution (real resolution, like on Agilent DSOX - not like on ATTEN , UNI-T or Tek DPO2000
  where 480x234 on 7" screen available)
- 16divs with menu on and 19divs  with hidden menu instead of 12divs on Rigol
- 3 times faster waveform update reducing dead times: 2500 wfms/s where on Rigol ~ 800 wfms/s
- in long memory mode with dual channel enabled 400MSs (i believe like on Instek, but never got this confirmed)
   instead of 250MSs (Rigol)
- additional persistency settings (0.2s, 0.4s, 0.8s) to what available on Rigol (1s, 2s, 5s, 10s, infinite)
- selectable screen refresh rate (30,40,50 auto), they usefull in cobination of XY or persistency or avg modes.
- more math functions (A/B, B/A, A+B, A-B, B-A, AxB) - as i remember Rigol have only A+B, A-B, AxB
- on FFT additonally Flaptop and Bartlett windows available on Hantek/Tekway
- selectable sample memory 4k, 40k, 512k, 1M(single chan) - on Rigol 8k/16k, Long Mem 512k/1M (dual/single chan)
- on Hantek/Tekway a real nice dual window with waveforms (for zoom in/out, scroll, play) or waveform/FFT available
- Hantek/Tekway have quick save screenshot on USB button (for lazy ppl)
- knobs per channel - nothing shared like on Rigol
- very nice shielding on Hantek/Tekway, not that cheap "all in one box" like on Rigol. Probably ppl don't care about,
  but personally i don't like a switching power supply 5cm above FPGA/memory or µC.

On the hardware side input stages are almost the same (however Hantek/Tekway optimized them for higher bw),
on the µC side Hantek/Tekway is using faster ARM9 from Samsung (S3C2440) - which explains faster waveform update.

On OS level is linux 2.6.13 running giving us of course more possibilietes to change/add
something (where you can't change anything on Rigol). This is not a real disadvantage if
you use DSO for measurments only, but is nice to have for hacks - like bw change via UART/linux shell.

End of April there will be Ethernet addon available from Hantek/Tekway, however i did designed already
similar module, so not gaps on Ethernet vs. Rigol.

The firmware is no (yet) supporting SCPI, no SDK available yet, but Hantek/Rigol are working on it -
however to stay faur "not available yet" is disadvantage.

Hantek/Tekway have no pass/fail external output - maybe not a big disadvantage for home users,
but well it is not there.

Hantek/Tekway are real quite, as no Fan inside.


I did compared Tekway and Rigol (and Atten/UNI-T) a year ago and decided to use Tekway (later Hantek sharehlders bogh Tekway, so now Tekway and Hantek are producing exact same DSO with different model names and different company logo/enclosure).

Other ppl did compared to more professional DSOs, like TDS2000C, TDS3000C, WaveAce - so you can beat with Hantek/Tekway definitely Rigol or WaveAce or TDS2000C (no TDS3000C is comparable, but in my private opinion better even if ppl who did compared think different), some ppl compared to UNI-T CEL series and decided to stay with Tekway/Hantek.

For sure i'm Tekway/Hantek enthusiast (so my opinion didn't really matter), but i think the
clear visible differences are enough to make a choice.

EDIT: are you from US? If so check mortoncontrols.com (Hantek DSO - even with NIST calibration and data), or electrolab.com (Tekway).
For sure ebay as always, or goodlucksell, or if you don't care about purchase from europe pinsonne-elektronik.de from Germany or elec3i from France.

[SuperMiguel]

there are some common things for both like available triggers, measure presets (however Hantek/Tekway added some additions in latest fw), csv exports/imports, ref and setups, PASS/FAIL, digital filters, recorder - so let's focus on diffs:

- 7" display, on Rigol 5.7"
- 800x480 resulution (real resolution, like on Agilent DSOX - not like on ATTEN , UNI-T or Tek DPO2000
  where 480x234 on 7" screen available)
- 16divs with menu on and 19divs  with hidden menu instead of 12divs on Rigol
- 3 times faster waveform update reducing dead times: 2500 wfrm/s where on Rigol ~ 800 wfrm/s
- in long memory mode with dual channel enabled 400MSs (i believe like on Instek, but never got this confirmed)
   instead of 250MSs (Rigol)
- additional persistency settings (0.2s, 0.4s, 0.8s) to what available on Rigol (1s, 2s, 5s, 10s, infinite)
- selectable screen refresh rate (30,40,50 auto), they usefull in cobination of XY or persistency or avg modes.
- more math functions (A/B, B/A, A+B, A-B, B-A, AxB) - as i remember Rigol have only A+B, A-B, AxB
- on FFT additonally Flaptop and Bartlett windows available on Hantek/Tekway
- selectable sample memory 4k, 40k, 512k, 1M(single chan) - on Rigol 8k/16k, Long Mem 512k/1M (dual/single chan)
- on Hantek/Tekway a real nice dual window with waveforms (for zoom in/out, scroll, play) or waveform/FFT available
- Hantek/Tekway have quick save screenshot on USB button (for lazy ppl)
- knobs per channel - nothing shared like on Rigol
- very nice shielding on Hantek/Tekway, not that cheap "all in one box" like on Rigol. Probably ppl don't care about,
  but personally i don't like a switching power supply 5cm above FPGA/memory or µC.

On the hardware side input stages are almost the same (however Hantek/Tekway optimized them for higher bw),
on the µC side Hantek/Tekway is using faster ARM9 from Samsung (S3C2440) - which explains faster waveform update.

On OS level is linux 2.6.13 running giving us of course more possibilietes to change/add
something (where you can't change anything on Rigol). This is not a real disadvantage if
you use DSO for measurments only, but is nice to have for hacks - like bw change via UART/linux shell.

End of April there will be Ethernet addon available from Hantek/Tekway, however i did designed already
similar module, so not gaps on Ethernet vs. Rigol.

The firmware is no (yet) supporting SCPI, no SDK available yet, but Hantek/Rigol are working on it -
however to stay faur "not available yet" is disadvantage.

Hantek/Tekway have no pass/fail external output - maybe not a big disadvantage for home users,
but well it is not there.

Hantek/Tekway are real quite, as no Fan inside.


I did compared Tekway and Rigol (and Atten/UNI-T) a year ago and decided to use Tekway (later Hantek sharehlders bogh Tekway, so now Tekway and Hantek are producing exact same DSO with different model names and different company logo/enclosure).

Other ppl did compared to more professional DSOs, like TDS2000C, TDS3000C, WaveAce - so you can beat with Hantek/Tekway definitely Rigol or WaveAce or TDS2000C (no TDS3000C is comparable, but in my private opinion better even if ppl who did compared think different), some ppl compared to UNI-T CEL series and decided to stay with Tekway/Hantek.

For sure i'm Tekway/Hantek enthusiast (so my opinion didn't really matter), but i think the
clear visible differences are enough to make a choice.

EDIT: are you from US? If so check mortoncontrols.com (Hantek DSO - even with NIST calibration and data), or electrolab.com (Tekway).
For sure ebay as always, or goodlucksell, or if you don't care about purchase from europe pinsonne-elektronik.de from Germany or elec3i from France.

ummm Thinking thinking... any reason i should get the hantek instead of the tekway? or the otherwayaround?

[tinhead]

ummm Thinking thinking... any reason i should get the hantek instead of the tekway? or the otherwayaround?

technical reason = no , not really, they equal (except issues from dec 2010 -  i got some Hantek's with 1% resistors insted of 0.1%, but probably due component market situation)

I did noticed that Tekway have better quality BNC connectors, AMP encoders and the buttons are better quality, where Hantek have no name connectors (or well, i wasn't able to match them to any manufacturer) and buttons are bit too hard for me - but that's cosmetic things.

For you probably would the best to check what available for what price (and of course what warrranty/addons/whatever).

I did forgot one thing, some ppl mentioned a bad display quality (view angle) on Hantek/Tekway DSOs. Actually this isn't true, the display is
mounted with 180° rotation ( it is InnoLux AT070TN83 V.1 if you need more tech. info about view angle/contrast) ,
so the best view angle is if the display is on same high as your eyes (or higher). There is no real mechanical reason why
the display has been monted like that, so it was probably pure usability decision.
For ppl like me who have many devices on wallshelf/workspace shelf above desk they just perfect (display is briliant),
for ppl who place them direktly on desk and look "from above" the contrast will be not the best due view angle,
but still ok if you change the "angle" by expanding the plastic feet's on the buttom of the DSO.

[SuperMiguel]

still thinking about it not sure if the $200 difference is worth it

[tinhead]

still thinking about it not sure if the $200 difference is worth it

well, then read first
http://www.wikihow.com/Choose-an-Oscilloscope
and then read again what i wrote about the diffs between both.

[SuperMiguel]

still thinking about it not sure if the $200 difference is worth it

well, then read first
http://www.wikihow.com/Choose-an-Oscilloscope
and then read again what i wrote about the diffs between both.

also that electrolab.com doesnt work very well... no pricing no way to order it.. any other us retailer selling the tekway?

[tinhead]

also that electrolab.com doesnt work very well... no pricing no way to order it.. any other us retailer selling the tekway?

yep, i know. Few months ago i saw pricing information on ebay, so you will have probably to ask them directly by phone/email.
Afaik no other US Tekway distributors available, for Hantek as already mentioned mortoncontrols.

[SuperMiguel]

also that electrolab.com doesnt work very well... no pricing no way to order it.. any other us retailer selling the tekway?

yep, i know. Few months ago i saw pricing information on ebay, so you will have probably to ask them directly by phone/email.
Afaik no other US Tekway distributors available, for Hantek as already mentioned mortoncontrols.

ya mortoncontrols looks like a reliable website but since u mentioned that the tekway was better built than the Hantek i was looking for that one

also that electrolab website only gives 90 day warranty.. http://electrolab.com/html/services.html instead of the 3 years that hantek gives

called electrolab and they dont have it, nor they have an eta, so i guess ima have to go with the hantek one.

[SuperMiguel]

HEHE thinking really hard about buying: https://www.mortoncontrols.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=450:09e7c0528bc59445a20d5779a968f174