Snake oil

[CJay]

Never underestimate the scammers, a regular one to turn up with the cal lab was palm oil engine cleaner, it's a 'suppressed technology' because governments, big oil, engine manufacturers, catalytic converter conglomerates etc. don't want it out there.

One guy even asked if we could rig a gas analyser to give different readings at the flick of a switch for him.

[cprobertson1]

Never underestimate the scammers, a regular one to turn up with the cal lab was palm oil engine cleaner, it's a 'suppressed technology' because governments, big oil, engine manufacturers, catalytic converter conglomerates etc. don't want it out there.

One guy even asked if we could rig a gas analyser to give different readings at the flick of a switch for him.

Crikey - that's amazing! I hope you told him where to go

It turns out the dowsing guy also visited a couple of other plants nearby - and even passed by our sister location an hour or two later... where by coincidence I was visiting for a meeting* - the look on his face was priceless.

Also, a quick correction to my previous post: "(what the **** is a "defectometer")" - turns out some NDT brands market their ultrasonic testic equipment as defectometers - just not a common term for it xD

*we spent an hour in this meeting. Captain obvious chaired the meeting. We decided to do what we were doing.

[CJay]

Never underestimate the scammers, a regular one to turn up with the cal lab was palm oil engine cleaner, it's a 'suppressed technology' because governments, big oil, engine manufacturers, catalytic converter conglomerates etc. don't want it out there.

One guy even asked if we could rig a gas analyser to give different readings at the flick of a switch for him.

Crikey - that's amazing! I hope you told him where to go

It turns out the dowsing guy also visited a couple of other plants nearby - and even passed by our sister location an hour or two later... where by coincidence I was visiting for a meeting* - the look on his face was priceless.

Also, a quick correction to my previous post: "(what the **** is a "defectometer")" - turns out some NDT brands market their ultrasonic testic equipment as defectometers - just not a common term for it xD

*we spent an hour in this meeting. Captain obvious chaired the meeting. We decided to do what we were doing.

Absolutely, totally apart from the obvious ethical and moral concerns we ran a UKAS accredited calibration laboratory (sounds much grander than it was, it was a mostly paperwork exercise to ensure traceability) and if we'd become associated with him it could have caused us a lot of trouble.

Plus, he was a slimy shitbag.

Wasn't the only time we were asked to do that, I have been asked on several occasions to miscalibrate and fudge a cal certificate so that exhaust fitting places could sell more.

They quickly decided it was a bad idea when I suggested I could refuse to issue calibration certificates and that'd mean they had to shut down testing though I've no doubt that there are places that could easily 'fix' the emissions test to achieve a higher failure rate (it'd be picked up by VOSA eventually).

[cprobertson1]

Absolutely, totally apart from the obvious ethical and moral concerns we ran a UKAS accredited calibration laboratory (sounds much grander than it was, it was a mostly paperwork exercise to ensure traceability) and if we'd become associated with him it could have caused us a lot of trouble.

Plus, he was a slimy shitbag.

Wasn't the only time we were asked to do that, I have been asked on several occasions to miscalibrate and fudge a cal certificate so that exhaust fitting places could sell more.

They quickly decided it was a bad idea when I suggested I could refuse to issue calibration certificates and that'd mean they had to shut down testing though I've no doubt that there are places that could easily 'fix' the emissions test to achieve a higher failure rate (it'd be picked up by VOSA eventually).

...absolutely amazing! It does worry me that somebody out there caters to their sort though - if they ask enough times I'm sure somebody will say "yeah, sure, why not?" one day - and it only takes one!


Also - a quick follow up to our dowsing-for-welding-defects-guy: we just had a new rep in not ten minutes ago and informed us that "the old guy" was fired due to a conflict of interests -
 turns out somebody from Doosan-Babcock called the vendor to say that their [old] rep was working with somebody trying to sell them - we had a new rep in not ten minutes ago to deliver our (super-fancy, has to be said) flexi-TIG/MIG heads

I guess he and his scam-artiste friend were in cahoots - who'd have guessed it! Maybe trying to sell dowsing rods to an ISO 9001/2900 company  was a dumb idea though...  (for those that don't know, this means that EVERY part of EVERY process is traceable. Case and point, yesterday I oversaw an ultrasonic inspection of a seam weld - the inspector (and their certificates), the cal cert for the probe, the cal cert for the probe leads, the cal cert for the UT meter, the cert of conformity for the ultrasonic gel, the full log of the welding parameters, the welder, the welder's certs, the material certs for the weld material, the material certs for the steel being welded, the position of each weld, the procedure of each weld, the certs for the procedure for each weld, and finally my certs ALL needed to be sent away to the client - do you know how much paperwork that is? It's about 500 pages in all.

...and you want me to use a dowsing rod... good luck getting certification for that... "Procedure XXX048 - for duplex welding of plate thickness 5mm-15mm, 2.1kJ/mm MAX, UT and Dowsing Rod inspection required" - yeah - I'd LOVE to see the calibration certs for a dowsing rod. In fact, I'd pay to see that sh**!

I just can't get over how ridiculous this whole idea was! Just thinking about the intricacies of using any piece of test equipment in this sort of environment let alone something from somebody we don't know, let alone A DOWSING ROD - it absolutely boggles the mind!




Anyhoo - the threads been quiet for a little while! Nobody found any new snake oil? I NEED MY FIX!

[Kilrah]

Somebody should have played the "I'm very interested!" game, watched the demo and such all seriously... then handed him a 1000 page document with all the efficiency proof, certifications, traceability and documentation shebangs HE will have to go through at HIS expense before he can sell it to you - but you're still VERY interested!

[CJay]

They quickly decided it was a bad idea when I suggested I could refuse to issue calibration certificates and that'd mean they had to shut down testing though I've no doubt that there are places that could easily 'fix' the emissions test to achieve a higher failure rate (it'd be picked up by VOSA eventually).

...absolutely amazing! It does worry me that somebody out there caters to their sort though - if they ask enough times I'm sure somebody will say "yeah, sure, why not?" one day - and it only takes one!
[/quote]

Indeed, but it's obvious when a machine is faulty or out of cal so a bodged calibration should be simple to spot, if the relevant agency gets complaints they're over a testing station like the plague so it's *really* not worth doing if you value your business and it could cause the lab owners a world of pain too.

I stumbled across a few forged certificates when out visiting clients, even though they're traceable all the way through the system it seems some people will do anything for £50 cash, he had at least calibrated the equipment correctly and it was accurate when checked.

That employee had been suspected for a while of theft and taking backhanders to do 'cheap' jobs using the parts and equipment stolen from stores so it wasn't a surprise, what did shock me was the MD's attitude to the evidence.

He was willing to issue proper certificates for the balance of the calibration fee and let it go as the employee turned in a better than average number of maintenance contract renewals (for which he earned a 10% commission on sales price) and sales leads (10% profits commission if they bought).

One of the reasons I left the company.

Also - a quick follow up to our dowsing-for-welding-defects-guy: turns out somebody from Doosan-Babcock called the vendor to say that their rep was working with somebody trying to sell them - we had a new rep in not ten minutes ago to deliver our (super-fancy, has to be said) flexi-TIG/MIG heads - and told us that "the old guy" was fired for a conflict of interests.

Nice, if he was in the game he really should have known it was BS surely?

[cprobertson1]

Somebody should have played the "I'm very interested!" game, watched the demo and such all seriously... then handed him a 1000 page document with all the efficiency proof, certifications, traceability and documentation shebangs HE will have to go through at HIS expense before he can sell it to you - but you're still VERY interested!

Dang! Wish I thought of that!

In case anybody is interested, I made a random snake-oil-product-generator script in python (a whole 5 minutes of work!)

It generates perfectly normal sounding things like "Non-Poisonous Crystal Necklaces" (good to have), "Asbestos-free RFI-cancelling Earphones" (also good to have) - but then again, it also generated "Radioactivity Supplement Pills" - which I just wouldn't want in my house...

NB -- you'll need python to run it - you'll also have to rename to remove the ".txt" extension since the forum won't let me post a .py file xD

If you don't have python and can't be bothered getting it, then you'll have to make do with a sample that I just generated and reading the source code

Virtual electrified textbooks
Organic electrified capacitors
All-natural microwavable hats
Healthy electrified necklace
LED absorbent lapel pins
Relaxing supplement guide to the internet
Magnetoelectric catalysing teddie-bears
Wireless Radio-wave hats
Non-Toxic interference cooker
Happy EMC-cancelling knobs

[cprobertson1]

Also - a quick follow up to our dowsing-for-welding-defects-guy: turns out somebody from Doosan-Babcock called the vendor to say that their rep was working with somebody trying to sell them - we had a new rep in not ten minutes ago to deliver our (super-fancy, has to be said) flexi-TIG/MIG heads - and told us that "the old guy" was fired for a conflict of interests.

Nice, if he was in the game he really should have known it was BS surely?
[/quote]

YUCK I'm double-posting!

I'm sure he knew it was BS - after all, it was his "friend" he was letting tag along - they probably decided to split the profits from any sales on the dowsing rod or something.

The new rep is much better tbh - he doesn't make the hairs on the back of my neck stand on end. He must be new to the game xD

[skarecrow]

If LEDs could make hair grow I'd be as hairy as an ape by now with all the LEDs on 24/7 in my house/car/job/etc.  Put a few of them in a bike helmet though and people will buy them all day long for $200 each!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/131975279019

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk

[schmitt trigger]

As the late Bob Pease once mentioned, the difference between a joke and a hoax is:

"...if you can't tell from the way it starts out, but by the time you get to the end, a good April Fool joke should give you enough clues so you can start to smile. But if you're merely puzzled, or skeptical, that could be a hoax. Conversely, if the guy tops off his story with "and send money," that's a clue that it may be turning into fraud."

So taking this thread a little cheek in tongue, does anyone remember Signetics Write Only Memory (WOM)?
They even published a datasheet. Not a hoax, but actually an excellent April Fool's joke:

https://www.google.com.mx/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwidv8y4xovUAhVQPVAKHdqfDgUQFgg-MAM&url=http%3A%2F%2Frepeater-builder.com%2Fmolotora%2Fgontor%2F25120-bw.pdf&usg=AFQjCNH6cyxjqum9NvtkaCZvVpHRAXVs7w&cad=rja

[CJay]

As the late Bob Pease once mentioned, the difference between a joke and a hoax is:

"...if you can't tell from the way it starts out, but by the time you get to the end, a good April Fool joke should give you enough clues so you can start to smile. But if you're merely puzzled, or skeptical, that could be a hoax. Conversely, if the guy tops off his story with "and send money," that's a clue that it may be turning into fraud."

So taking this thread a little cheek in tongue, does anyone remember Signetics Write Only Memory (WOM)?
They even published a datasheet. Not a hoax, but actually an excellent April Fool's joke:

https://www.google.com.mx/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwidv8y4xovUAhVQPVAKHdqfDgUQFgg-MAM&url=http%3A%2F%2Frepeater-builder.com%2Fmolotora%2Fgontor%2F25120-bw.pdf&usg=AFQjCNH6cyxjqum9NvtkaCZvVpHRAXVs7w&cad=rja

There was also the Dark Emitting Diode, I think that one was a National product?

[jh15]

Quite a coincidence, a couple months ago, I was tossing out old work papers and scanning interesting stuff into my phone. One was this very paper.

Years later working on avionics equipment, there was a device that that for some reason wrote to four memory areas. It only read from three, all it needed. I always remembered and joked about WOMs then.

[schmitt trigger]

"Magnetoelectric catalysing teddie-bears"

Are these UL-approved for small children? I would like to purchase a couple for my grand daughter's birthday. 

[Richard Crowley]

It is a "charge-accellerator" and it "recharges itself"!
But "it is NOT a perpetual-motion machine."  (So they say)

https://youtu.be/fI9aFUGtzU8

[McBryce]

But there's already a Q3!!! It must be even better!



McBryce.

[cprobertson1]

I have to say, some of these "XYZ-Machines" and builds on youtube look pretty cool, even if they don't work the way their creators believe (or say they believe) that they work.

I'm always amused when I see a small motor attached to a big motor which is wired back to the small motor and claims it's a perpetual motion machine. It always seems to slow down though, pesky physics always ruins their fun!

[schmitt trigger]

It is a "charge-accellerator" and it "recharges itself"!
But "it is NOT a perpetual-motion machine."  (So they say)

https://youtu.be/fI9aFUGtzU8

The only thing that this guy gets right, is mentioning that supercapacitors and batteries are different

[Kilrah]

That's an unprecedented level of misunderstanding, denying claims of free energy etc but then announcing things that could only be "possible" using such principles...
Good communication skills used for scamming purposes or stupidity... as usual we'll never know.

His thing looks great though, very nice to see.

[X]

But there's already a Q3!!! It must be even better!



McBryce.

"It kinda looked to me like this new configuration had begun taking on a persona of a 1950's sci-fi movie, with it's pale-green medical-looking toroid..."

So now there's adenoids, thyroids, rhomboids (on steroids), and toroids.

[gildasd]

But there's already a Q3!!! It must be even better!

McBryce.

"It kinda looked to me like this new configuration had begun taking on a persona of a 1950's sci-fi movie, with it's pale-green medical-looking toroid..."

So now there's adenoids, thyroids, rhomboids (on steroids), and toroids.

The science behind these things is worthless, but as a kenematic/electronic art piece - wow!

[X]

But there's already a Q3!!! It must be even better!

McBryce.

"It kinda looked to me like this new configuration had begun taking on a persona of a 1950's sci-fi movie, with it's pale-green medical-looking toroid..."

So now there's adenoids, thyroids, rhomboids (on steroids), and toroids.

The science behind these things is worthless, but as a kenematic/electronic art piece - wow!

I first thought it was a parody or an artwork thanks to the theremin music at the start.

[cprobertson1]

Hey, have stainless-steel soaps ever cropped up on this thread? I can't find any! Brings a new meaning to phrase "bar of soap", and if you carry the woo far enough, "ingots of soap" too.

Rational Wiki is much more informative on the matter, and includes a list of pros and cons

[McBryce]

Hey, have stainless-steel soaps ever cropped up on this thread? I can't find any! Brings a new meaning to phrase "bar of soap", and if you carry the woo far enough, "ingots of soap" too.

Rational Wiki is much more informative on the matter, and includes a list of pros and cons

As a student I once worked for a few weeks in a Fishmongers. Literally every surface of the shop was made of stainless steel and my hands were in contact with these surfaces the whole day. I wonder why they still stank of fish when I got home?

McBryce.

[cprobertson1]

Hey, have stainless-steel soaps ever cropped up on this thread? I can't find any! Brings a new meaning to phrase "bar of soap", and if you carry the woo far enough, "ingots of soap" too.

Rational Wiki is much more informative on the matter, and includes a list of pros and cons

As a student I once worked for a few weeks in a Fishmongers. Literally every surface of the shop was made of stainless steel and my hands were in contact with these surfaces the whole day. I wonder why they still stank of fish when I got home?

McBryce.

I just want to know how it's inventor noticed it was deodourising his hands... Was he assiduously cutting garlic and onions before rinsing it under water while rubbing steel and then sniffing it? Even if it was the result of legitimate research, it must have had a pretty odd premise!

In fact, a lot of snake oil origins seem rather vague... I mean "I researched it" is an obvious one... But your "who would have guessed it!" story about how an everyday item/ingredient cures all your ails?

So you believe that tomato juice rubbed on your feet cured your inherited disease?... I have SEVERAL questions!

I haven't came across as many electronic snake oils in a while though - though I did *hear* a few crackers a month or two back at the Glasgow Ham fest... Some hams have a really shakey idea of electronics and how EM radiation works: and one guy mentioned dowsing in what I sincerely hope was satire... On the flipside, some awesome ham bouncing microwaves off a crane to make contact with a repeater 100 miles in the opposite direction? That's just cool xD

[IanMacdonald]

But there's already a Q3!!! It must be even better!



McBryce.

"It kinda looked to me like this new configuration had begun taking on a persona of a 1950's sci-fi movie, with it's pale-green medical-looking toroid..."

So now there's adenoids, thyroids, rhomboids (on steroids), and toroids.

Is that a rectifier mounted on WOOD?   

I suppose if it only passes 0.01mA then it hardly matters.