scam or legit order?

[tsman]

Tell them you cashed the check, but they overpaid... Ask them where to send the difference.... See what they say and forward that address to local law-enforcement in the area citing overpayment scams...

Unless they're really inept, you'll just get the details of some random sucker. They'll be cashing cheques for the scammer in their own account and then transferring the money somewhere abroad. They may even be the person in Vegas that printed out the cheques.

The hook is that they get to keep some large percentage of the cheque as a fee and it is all legitimate company operations that needs payment processing.

[Werecow]

Sultan Mohammed, using the same company name, is trying the same overpayment scam with my company.  The order initially looked like about an 80% chance of being fraudulent, due to his email address and the fact he didn't have a clue what he was ordering.  Those aren't always red flags, though, as we had a very similar start several months ago that ended with a legit $23K transaction.  So, unfortunately, since we regularly do business with clients around the world, we have to go along with the charades as though they're all legitimate orders, until we have proof of the scam. 

The expected email did eventually arrive last week, with the claim that a wire transfer for ~$100K above the invoiced amount was being sent -- "in error", of course -- and instructions that the difference should be wired to an as yet unnamed third party's account.

Bottom line:  In a case like this, we alert our bank to the possibility of a transfer or check for the specified amount appearing in our account.  They will put a hold on the funds and immediately notify us and the issuing bank if/when the money appears.  This account was set up only to receive wire transfers; no checks can be drawn on it, and any balance is automatically transferred to other accounts.  Reversing a wire transfer is very rare, but this puts one more roadblock in the way of anyone who tries to do it.

Bonus:  Mohammed's purchase order shows a cell phone number, very likely the only thing about this deal that's not fraudulent.  Some fun could probably be had with that ... 

[jmelson]

So, Werecow, did you (or your bank) get a check?  After telling me there'd be a wire transfer, they sent a paper check DIRECTLY to my bank, which seems a really ODD practice.  Contacting the outfit the check was drawn on, the check WOULD have initially cleared, as the ABA and account numbers were valid.  3 recipients actually DID deposit their checks, to the great consternation of the outfit the checks were drawn on.

The checks were printed with a laser printer on generic check forms that you can buy on Amazon.  They did actually copy the logo and other info for the company they wrote the checks on, which makes me think of maybe disgruntled/dismissed employees.

The checks were sent from one of those Mailboxes, Etc. type places in Las Vegas, although the guy claims he is from Dubai.

I still have the check and mailing envelope, I was hoping somebody would be investigating this and want the evidence.

Jon

[envisionelec]

I was a victim of check fraud, but in the form of a stolen FEDEX account number. My account was used to ship 47 fraudulent checks OVERNIGHT all across the USA. I was getting calls from angry people, police detectives, etc. My customer service skills were really tested that week.

It took a lot of legwork and frustration, but I was completely cleared of all fraud within a few months.

[Kean]

It took a lot of legwork and frustration, but I was completely cleared of all fraud within a few months.

Ouch!

[a59d1]

btw Dubai is a wealthy city there is no such a need for stealing anything or pick pocketting somebody...

Some parts of Dubai are wealthy.

[RJS]

This guy contacted me today trying to make a purchase VIA wire as well. He is not in Dubai. I was able to track them down using the online chat from my website which shows IP address and location. He is in NIGERIA.

169.159.106.5
Lagos, Lagos, Nigeria

[jmelson]

This guy contacted me today trying to make a purchase VIA wire as well. He is not in Dubai. I was able to track them down using the online chat from my website which shows IP address and location. He is in NIGERIA.

169.159.106.5
Lagos, Lagos, Nigeria

Well, if the wire comes in, let it SIT for a few days, at least, to make sure it is not fraudulent.

Jon

[hermit]

Tell him you can only accept Bitcoin.

[1sciguy]

First post for me.  I find this particular thread amusing.  Yes, I too was contacted by Mohammed a few years ago for my business.  I knew it was a scam and cut off communication.  But this year I had something else interesting occur.  I received an inquiry for an order of my products from an individual who claimed to be from Facebook.  His email address was had XXX@fb.com.  I was skeptical.  We talked some more and he said before we could discuss his project I would have to fill out a non-disclosure agreement.  This form came to be filled out electronically from and address of XXX@thefacebook.com.  Hmmm.  Something sounds fishy, but I continued because I was not releasing any personal information that was not already available through the government SAM system.  Well it boiled down to them telling me they wanted to place the order ($5000 worth of equipment, which is normal for my product line) and I needed to fill out a form to become a facebook vendor.  This form came from a third party registrar and was asking for VERY detailed information about my company size, bank transfer routing numbers, lists of other clients and amount of sales in the past year.  This was more intrusive than even the government bureaucracy of the SAM (System Awards Management) in USA.  At this point I put my foot down and said absolutely not.  I told them if they wanted my product, they could hire an electrician to install my product and the electrician can make the purchase.  Guess what?  It was all legitimate!  I made the sale and got paid, but the process had so many red flags along the way.  You should have seen me... doing reverse IP lookups and checking google earth for registrar addresses.  All pointed to the Facebook complex.  Crazy stuff.

[Johnny10]

So you are Mohammed?

[Stray Electron]

First post for me.  I find this particular thread amusing.  Yes, I too was contacted by Mohammed a few years ago for my business.  I knew it was a scam and cut off communication.  But this year I had something else interesting occur.  I received an inquiry for an order of my products from an individual who claimed to be from Facebook.  His email address was had XXX@fb.com.  I was skeptical.  We talked some more and he said before we could discuss his project I would have to fill out a non-disclosure agreement.  This form came to be filled out electronically from and address of XXX@thefacebook.com.  Hmmm.  Something sounds fishy, but I continued because I was not releasing any personal information that was not already available through the government SAM system.  Well it boiled down to them telling me they wanted to place the order ($5000 worth of equipment, which is normal for my product line) and I needed to fill out a form to become a facebook vendor.  This form came from a third party registrar and was asking for VERY detailed information about my company size, bank transfer routing numbers, lists of other clients and amount of sales in the past year.  This was more intrusive than even the government bureaucracy of the SAM (System Awards Management) in USA.  At this point I put my foot down and said absolutely not.  I told them if they wanted my product, they could hire an electrician to install my product and the electrician can make the purchase.  Guess what?  It was all legitimate!  I made the sale and got paid, but the process had so many red flags along the way.  You should have seen me... doing reverse IP lookups and checking google earth for registrar addresses.  All pointed to the Facebook complex.  Crazy stuff.

   I've dealt with legitmate companies that were very intrusive too (Fermi Labs for one) but I found that they were more trouble than they were worth and I refused to answer all of their questions and SWEAR to the answers and to PROVE that I was complying with all of the requirements that the US Gov had imposed on them and required that they flow down to all of their vendors (like drug testing!).  Since I was the only that could supply their needs, they started paying me in cash and up front!   I later went through the same thing with Air France. Life to too short to deal with possible scammers or with a bunch of bean counter bureaucrats that want obsessive amounts of paper work and I'm sure as hell not going to try and prove THEIR compliance with a bunch of ridiculous US or other Gov requirements.  It's simple; if you want something, pay me the money without making me jump through a bunch of hoops to get it, then I'll deliver your goods or services.  And I don't do refunds, if you paid me too much then cancel the check and send me a new one. Otherwise, take your purchase/scam elsewhere.

[Richard Crowley]

Some parts of Dubai are wealthy.

Probably most parts.
But you can't prove that they are really from Dubai or in Dubai or on behalf of Dubai (or anywhere else for that matter).

[1sciguy]

   I've dealt with legitmate companies that were very intrusive too (Fermi Labs for one) but I found that they were more trouble than they were worth and I refused to answer all of their questions and SWEAR to the answers and to PROVE that I was complying with all of the requirements that the US Gov had imposed on them and required that they flow down to all of their vendors (like drug testing!).  Since I was the only that could supply their needs, they started paying me in cash and up front!   I later went through the same thing with Air France. Life to too short to deal with possible scammers or with a bunch of bean counter bureaucrats that want obsessive amounts of paper work and I'm sure as hell not going to try and prove THEIR compliance with a bunch of ridiculous US or other Gov requirements.  It's simple; if you want something, pay me the money without making me jump through a bunch of hoops to get it, then I'll deliver your goods or services.  And I don't do refunds, if you paid me too much then cancel the check and send me a new one. Otherwise, take your purchase/scam elsewhere.

I'm in the same situation.  I am the only manufacturer of a product, and they know it.  Strange.  I sell to all of the National Labs on a fairly frequent basis and have never had to go through much hassle.  Perhaps because I'm registered in SAM and they can see my "sweared" compliance to "equal opportunity employment" and all the other BS.  I am also registered in DUNS & Bradstreet.  The SAM registration is like 50 pages of BS.  There are tons of companies that offer their services to get you SAM certified, but it is just a matter of going to the web site and checking all the boxes.

[jmelson]

   I've dealt with legitmate companies that were very intrusive too (Fermi Labs for one)

Yes, I occasionally sell to state universities that are buying on US government grants, or even WORSE, state grants!  They asked all sorts of intrusive questions about child support judgements and legal cases, and want to make sure that all my "employees" take regular training on harassment laws gender compliance.  Never mind that I am a one-man shop with zero employees.

It's kind of down to the level of the Senator McCarthy hearings with the "do you now, or have you ever..." questions, where practically any answer is an admission of something.

Jon

[Circlotron]

It's kind of down to the level of the Senator McCarthy hearings with the "do you now, or have you ever..." questions, where practically any answer is an admission of something.

e.g. "have you stopped doing bad things?" Y/N