EEZ Bench Box 3 - Sequel to EEZ H24005

[Andrew McNamara]

Maybe they're using one of these?

[prasimix]

Ha, ha, yes, that's a good candidate. The last time they complained to me that they had difficulty soldering that triac and that they had to use a 90 W soldering iron !!!
Of course I tried this with my ancient 50 W Weller which did the job (with an adequate tip) without any problems.

[exe]

Is it an option to move production of the rest of the boards to another assembly service?

[prasimix]

If I were in a better financial situation or if I had a bigger margin I would have done it a long time ago. However since I had to pay Assemtec Europe in advance over 80% (for parts) this is not an option.

[Andrew McNamara]

Ha, ha, yes, that's a good candidate. The last time they complained to me that they had difficulty soldering that triac and that they had to use a 90 W soldering iron !!!

There are more options than there used to be for soldering parts like this, and I'm shocked a professional assembly house would have trouble with it.

[prasimix]

AssemTech Europe delivered 64 new modules last week. The fault rate was 32.8% but I managed to get all but one module functional. As before with minimal visual control most mistakes could have been avoided.

There are about as many modules on the way (I expect them tomorrow), and supposedly they should send me a hundred new ones this week. I got a new promise that all the remaining modules should be delivered next week.

I am currently missing over 180 modules to be able to complete the campaign fulfillment.

I also found out the name of the subcontractor for the DCP405 modules. The company is PRODEL to which AssemTech allegedly sent all the parts for assembly on May 6th. They were supposed to do it in 4 days. Certainly not Earth days, maybe on Mercury. Then they are still on time! This would be my suggestion for a hero image on their homepage...

[Ranayna]

If you don't mind my asking...

Would the supplier be liable for defects that only come up after a while? Thinking about that error rate you described, how much stuff maybe there that is *not* easily noticed?
That might bite you in a year or so, if a sizable amount of units develops issues.
Or does Crowdsupply handle the warranty themselves? I can't imaging that they will take the risk though...

[prasimix]

As you may have already noticed this has already turned into a real nightmare. And yes, you’re right, and thanks for opening up that question, the nightmare could get a “second episode/wave” in which multiple complaints could follow.
I have already expressed my concern to AssemTec Europe, but just as with other issues, they seem to have decided to ignore it as well.
All the blame goes to me, Crowd Supply has nothing to do with it. I will try to prepare for something like that and offer a replacement for any meaningful complaints.
I am currently doing everything in my power to prepare for deliveries modules that have passed important tests. Clearly, there is never enough testing, and I am neither equipped nor equipped to do a thorough testing of each module at this time.

[AlanS]

Perhaps the current purchasers could offer you an insurance premium to stock 'spare' replacement boards and hard to get parts. I know this is difficult for you but some of us will want you to succeed and keep developing on the platform- something you will not be able to do if you are forever cleaning up. I don't know what a good figure would be - but 10% of current purchase price does not seem unreasonable.

[Ranayna]

Hmm, let's be honest here. I don't think such a surcharge would fly. I don't think that it can even be done legally, at the very least not without offering a refund instead of the 10% extra.
And while this is a small project, can you imagine the backlash that some larger Kickstarter project would get, trying to pull something like that off?

One thing is for sure though:
I would expect many people that are active here, to at least try most repairs themselves. I would certainly be willing to try, but I don't know if i would be able to

[exe]

I'm afraid there are all sorts of people, from those who can capable of designing a power supply themselves, to people who will complain about every tiny detail due to misunderstanding, or too high expectations...

[prasimix]

I'm afraid there are all sorts of people, from those who can capable of designing a power supply themselves, to people who will complain about every tiny detail due to misunderstanding, or too high expectations...

That's right, something that further complicate a whole situation is that BB3 is delivered as a kit not assembled and tested as a whole unit. I'll do my best to continue with support as before. No module will leave me for which there is even the slightest suspicion that something is wrong with it. So far, 8 DCP405 modules fall into that category and are set aside.

[exe]

I wish I could say "send me the broken modules", but I ordered bare pcbs... Nonetheless,  some people might prefer to order broken modules because repairing is fun .

[prasimix]

I wish I could say "send me the broken modules", but I ordered bare pcbs... Nonetheless,  some people might prefer to order broken modules because repairing is fun .

Huh, after spending many hours on some of them without resolving problem I came to the conclusion that it might only help to solder everything from scratch to a new bare PCB. It started as fun and turned into a new frustration. 

[AlanS]

I suppose what I was looking for was a way to help Denis and co out without wringing them dry trying to fix what is not their fault. But as has been said human nature being what it is........

[prasimix]

AssemTec Europe continued the practice of delays and delivery of questionable quality modules. Every new batch instead with joy I now await with anxiety. It is still an unsolved mystery how it is possible that someone needs so much time to deliver such small quantities of such pathetic quality. All my complaints are simply ignored, and I am ashamed even to post some of the things I received. That looks really embarrassing!

I have no real words with which to address the backers for this situation. To say that I am sorry and that there is a good chance that BB3 will not meet expectations is insufficient. AssemTec Europe and their subcontractor Prodel have indeed called into question the existence of the complete project. No matter what, I don’t intend to stop. Maybe this will somehow work out in the end. I asked them to send me the remaining modules by the end of this week or to return the money in the value of the remaining modules so they can arrange assembly elsewhere. I didn't get an answer to that either. I wonder what kind of people are they anyway. I’ve heard so many unfulfilled promises and blatant lies that it’s simply unbelievable. In the end it will turn out that I can be happy that they delivered anything and not just disappeared with the money?

A couple of hours ago I got a tracking number for a new shipment. Judging by the weight, there should be enough modules to complete the shipment for campaign fulfillment. Pre-orders will most likely need to wait some more time.

Thank you once again from the bottom of my heart for your great patience, understanding and support.

[Ranayna]

To be honest, i was not sure how i should reply to this situation...

I have decided to keep it simple: Thank you for being so open about this
I wonder what we, as a community, could realistically do to help you out. Except of course not giving you a hard time about this, and staying patient.

Maybe someone living near the assemby house can pay them a friendly visit? :p

[prasimix]

Thanks Ranayna for your reply. At one point I was thinking I should take the van and head to Poland to knock on their door and ask them to give me either all the modules or parts. However, I don’t know what I would find there at all and I’m no longer sure they even bought all the parts at once and had them in late February as they said!
Yesterday I found out that is a two-man company (actually just one according to Dun & Bradstreet current brief overview) ... something like the Bolek and Lolek brothers! To make the situation more grotesque, I now see that one of the authors of that cartoon is called Leszek just like one of probably two brothers in AssemTec Europe. I can't help but turn this into a joke.

[Andrew McNamara]

Yesterday I found out that is a two-man company (actually just one according to Dun & Bradstreet current brief overview)

Everything so far has suggested a tiny operation. The boards don't look hand-loaded, but I'm not sure how you could possibly make a machine go this slow. Again, if they were just honest about the situation, whatever it may be... maybe their PnP machine got repossessed... or maybe the rubber band broke, and they couldn't find the sticky tape and string...

[AlanS]

Yesterday I found out that is a two-man company (actually just one according to Dun & Bradstreet current brief overview)

Everything so far has suggested a tiny operation. The boards don't look hand-loaded, but I'm not sure how you could possibly make a machine go this slow. Again, if they were just honest about the situation, whatever it may be... maybe their PnP machine got repossessed... or maybe the rubber band broke, and they couldn't find the sticky tape and string...

Let's Go Fly a Kite
Dick Van Dyke
With tuppence for paper and strings
You can have your own set of wings
With your feet on the ground
You're a bird in a flight
With your fist holding tight
To the string of your kite

Flying a kite seems appropriate...........

[exe]

Yesterday I found out that is a two-man company

Oh, that's twice smaller than I thought...

I hope delays are not due to them spent all the money and now they need cash from new orders to fulfill old orders...

[prasimix]

I hope delays are not due to them spent all the money and now they need cash from new orders to fulfill old orders...

I also really do believe that is not the case. Even that would be somewhat acceptable if they decided to communicate about all the issues openly and honestly which I have been asking from the beginning. However this is not the case and it is so disappointing.

[vad]

Are the PCBs and the enclosure manufactured by the same Polish vendor? I am one of the backers who ordered the enclosure & PCBs set, and have been waiting for shipment since March. What is the reason for delay for those who did not order the assembled modules? Apologies if this has been answered in this thread before.

[prasimix]

Are the PCBs and the enclosure manufactured by the same Polish vendor? I am one of the backers who ordered the enclosure & PCBs set, and have been waiting for shipment since March. What is the reason for delay for those who did not order the assembled modules? Apologies if this has been answered in this thread before.

Bare PCBs were ordered from the same vendor and were delivered a long time ago. The enclosures arrived from Portugal. So, the Enclosure & PCBs set has been ready for delivery for months. However, this did not happen because at first there were no flights to the US, transport prices went sky high and I wanted to make single delivery counting that everything else would be with me a long time ago. However this has not yet happened due to a mystery called the DCP405 module.
I have good news though, a new batch of these modules is on the way and there should be enough of them to complete the campaign, so if no new hurdle arises I should send everything to Mouser in the next two weeks!

[prasimix]

And finally that day came: yesterday enough correct DCP405 modules arrived that today we finished packing for campaign fulfillment and first pre-orders. We just need to organize the sending (actually we still don't know what is a destination address of Mouser warehouse )!