Working From Home - Impacts of Coronavirus

[nctnico]

I was simply commenting that what Dave speculated might happen, may, in fact, be happening - based on that one news report and accompanying graph.

I was not thinking about immunity issues at all but rather that it is due to an increased awareness of better sanitary habits - being careful not to spread your germs - a vigilance.

Immunity from flu shots seems to be reported at about 6 months (https://www.immunize.org/askexperts/experts_inf.asp).

Immunity from actually having the flu is less well known, but is much more likely to be much longer (https://www.nhs.uk/news/heart-and-lungs/first-time-flu-infection-may-affect-lifetime-immunity/).

Immunity from the first flu is only against that particular virus strain. Any other flu virus (Corona, Influenza and Rhino strains) causes temporary immunity. This immunity wears off after a couple of years.

[VK3DRB]

I live in the state of Victoria which is about to become the world's biggest "prison" of 6.6 million people for the next six weeks at least. We are in lock down as of 12pm tomorrow night. New South Wales border will be fortified with police and the military. Movement between states can only be done with a special pass, which is not available as yet.

The cause for this massive lock down is twofold:
1. Government not policing social distancing, not enforcing mask wearing, not policing quarantine hotels (a debacle), and allowing tens of thousands of BLM "concerned citizens" and the Greenies to protest march.
2. Reckless citizens. Crowds at shopping centres, not social distancing and not wearing masks. I have witnessed it. About half the people requested to be tested in hotspots declined. The BLMers and Greenies demonstrated their contempt for their fellow citizens. Selfish and irresponsible public in general.

The solution:
1. Authoritarian government that can make hard and wise decisions.
2. Punishment for citizens who do not obey the strict rules.

Work wise, I will be working mostly on PCBA development and documentation from my office. I will cope quite well considering the amount of work I have.
I feel sorry for the school kids who have to take more time off school and be in isolation. And the vulnerable. It is not fair to them.

[Ed.Kloonk]

I live in the state of Victoria which is about to become the world's biggest "prison" of 6.6 million people for the next six weeks at least. We are in lock down as of 12pm tomorrow night. New South Wales border will be fortified with police and the military. Movement between states can only be done with a special pass, which is not available as yet.

The cause for this massive lock down is twofold:
1. Government not policing social distancing, not enforcing mask wearing, not policing quarantine hotels (a debacle), and allowing tens of thousands of BLM "concerned citizens" and the Greenies to protest march.
2. Reckless citizens. Crowds at shopping centres, not social distancing and not wearing masks. I have witnessed it. About half the people requested to be tested in hotspots declined. The BLMers and Greenies demonstrated their contempt for their fellow citizens. Selfish and irresponsible public in general.

The solution:
1. Authoritarian government that can make hard and wise decisions.
2. Punishment for citizens who do not obey the strict rules.

Work wise, I will be working mostly on PCBA development and documentation from my office. I will cope quite well considering the amount of work I have.
I feel sorry for the school kids who have to take more time off school and be in isolation. And the vulnerable. It is not fair to them.

Last week our Premier (NSW) told us not to welcome Victorians into our houses. I thought "Yep. Them and homosexuals"




 

[Zero999]

I was simply commenting that what Dave speculated might happen, may, in fact, be happening - based on that one news report and accompanying graph.

I was not thinking about immunity issues at all but rather that it is due to an increased awareness of better sanitary habits - being careful not to spread your germs - a vigilance.

Immunity from flu shots seems to be reported at about 6 months (https://www.immunize.org/askexperts/experts_inf.asp).

Immunity from actually having the flu is less well known, but is much more likely to be much longer (https://www.nhs.uk/news/heart-and-lungs/first-time-flu-infection-may-affect-lifetime-immunity/).

Immunity from the first flu is only against that particular virus strain. Any other flu virus (Corona, Influenza and Rhino strains) causes temporary immunity. This immunity wears off after a couple of years.

Corona and Rhino viruses are not related to flu.

Immunity is not binary. Someone who's been exposed to or immunised against a certain virus doesn't suddenly lose all of their immunity after a set period such as six months. They might get the same virus again, but have a much milder illness this time, because they will still have some immunity.

I live in the state of Victoria which is about to become the world's biggest "prison" of 6.6 million people for the next six weeks at least. We are in lock down as of 12pm tomorrow night. New South Wales border will be fortified with police and the military. Movement between states can only be done with a special pass, which is not available as yet.

The cause for this massive lock down is twofold:
1. Government not policing social distancing, not enforcing mask wearing, not policing quarantine hotels (a debacle), and allowing tens of thousands of BLM "concerned citizens" and the Greenies to protest march.
2. Reckless citizens. Crowds at shopping centres, not social distancing and not wearing masks. I have witnessed it. About half the people requested to be tested in hotspots declined. The BLMers and Greenies demonstrated their contempt for their fellow citizens. Selfish and irresponsible public in general.

The solution:
1. Authoritarian government that can make hard and wise decisions.
2. Punishment for citizens who do not obey the strict rules.

Work wise, I will be working mostly on PCBA development and documentation from my office. I will cope quite well considering the amount of work I have.
I feel sorry for the school kids who have to take more time off school and be in isolation. And the vulnerable. It is not fair to them.

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

[nctnico]

I was simply commenting that what Dave speculated might happen, may, in fact, be happening - based on that one news report and accompanying graph.

I was not thinking about immunity issues at all but rather that it is due to an increased awareness of better sanitary habits - being careful not to spread your germs - a vigilance.

Immunity from flu shots seems to be reported at about 6 months (https://www.immunize.org/askexperts/experts_inf.asp).

Immunity from actually having the flu is less well known, but is much more likely to be much longer (https://www.nhs.uk/news/heart-and-lungs/first-time-flu-infection-may-affect-lifetime-immunity/).

Immunity from the first flu is only against that particular virus strain. Any other flu virus (Corona, Influenza and Rhino strains) causes temporary immunity. This immunity wears off after a couple of years.

Corona and Rhino viruses are not related to flu.

Technically speaking not but they all cause the same symptoms for a sickness called 'the flu' or 'cold' in general.

[themadhippy]

In the caring UK  our very nice taxman has decided if your company pays for your corona test its a taxable benefit,how nice of them.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53324101

[bd139]

Cunts!

[themadhippy]

Cunts!

Couldn't have put it better myself

[PlainName]

if your company pays for your corona test its a taxable benefit

!

That's scraping the barrel a bit, to put it mildly. However, I would argue that it is a business expense since its primary effect is to the business (that is, whether they can give you work or have other employees isolate). The benefit to the employee is only incidental.

Next, they'll consider PPE to be a taxable benefit whereas it should be a tool required to do your job (hence a person should get a tax refund if they've bought some).

[Zero999]

if your company pays for your corona test its a taxable benefit

!

That's scraping the barrel a bit, to put it mildly. However, I would argue that it is a business expense since its primary effect is to the business (that is, whether they can give you work or have other employees isolate). The benefit to the employee is only incidental.

Next, they'll consider PPE to be a taxable benefit whereas it should be a tool required to do your job (hence a person should get a tax refund if they've bought some).

Obviously a COVID-19 test benifits society, not just the employer, so taxing it is stupid, especially when such tests are handed out freely by the NHS.

[coppice]

if your company pays for your corona test its a taxable benefit

!

That's scraping the barrel a bit, to put it mildly. However, I would argue that it is a business expense since its primary effect is to the business (that is, whether they can give you work or have other employees isolate). The benefit to the employee is only incidental.

Next, they'll consider PPE to be a taxable benefit whereas it should be a tool required to do your job (hence a person should get a tax refund if they've bought some).

We have a free health care system in the UK. If your employer pays for additional private health care that is consider a perk, and taxed. The government hasn't specifically decided to tax COVID-19 tests. They just tax private health care perks. They would have needed to take specific action NOT to tax these tests.

[maginnovision]

Why would you want to tax individuals health care with a socialized system? I get you do it if you can but I'd think that you'd want to promote that since then they pay in to the system but take less out.

[Zero999]

if your company pays for your corona test its a taxable benefit

!

That's scraping the barrel a bit, to put it mildly. However, I would argue that it is a business expense since its primary effect is to the business (that is, whether they can give you work or have other employees isolate). The benefit to the employee is only incidental.

Next, they'll consider PPE to be a taxable benefit whereas it should be a tool required to do your job (hence a person should get a tax refund if they've bought some).

We have a free health care system in the UK. If your employer pays for additional private health care that is consider a perk, and taxed. The government hasn't specifically decided to tax COVID-19 tests. They just tax private health care perks. They would have needed to take specific action NOT to tax these tests.

That's a valid point. I have private healthcare from my employer and am taxed on it.

This seems like an oversight, as it does seem stupid to tax something so benefical to society.

Why would you want to tax individuals health care with a socialized system? I get you do it if you can but I'd think that you'd want to promote that since then they pay in to the system but take less out.

I agree, it does seem silly. On the other hand, employers give people perks, rather than higher pay, so they could just up their salary.

[coppice]

Why would you want to tax individuals health care with a socialized system? I get you do it if you can but I'd think that you'd want to promote that since then they pay in to the system but take less out.

Why would you expect those in the UK with private health care insurance to take less out of the public health care system? Private health care in the UK has mostly been a way to queue jump into the public system, who then pick up the bulk of the bills.

[VK3DRB]

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

Agreed. Where were the protesters 1 year ago? 10 years ago? When John Pat was bashed by the Western Australian police and killed 37 years ago? All missing in action. Whilst BLM is an important issue, the BLM protesters here in Australia are way out of line. Most of them did not wear a mask and failed to distance themselves. They could not give a rats arse if they spread COVID-19 as they marched as self-proclaimed heroes for justice. In technical terms, they are classed as "First Class Wankers".

[james_s]

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

I think that's part of it, but it also has the appearance of being largely an anti-capitalism and anti-authority movement. In my area much of what was going on felt just like the old Occupy movement that fizzled out several years ago. People capitalizing on a tragic event to get the masses on board with a movement that a lot of people otherwise wouldn't be on board with. It's far easier to drum up support when you can just call anyone who isn't a fanatical supporter a racist. Between the pandemic and other events there was a perfect storm that created a nearly ideal environment to try to cultivate a revolution. Like happened with the Occupy movement, I suspect it will get fragmented and fizzle out eventually. They start out with a noble goal but then it becomes chaotic and disorganized and more people try to piggyback their own pet agendas.

[PlainName]

Where were the protesters 1 year ago? 10 years ago?

More easily placated or ignored by the authorities. Fortunately, mobs don't go full nuclear each and every time but require stoking and momentum building.

[SilverSolder]

Where were the protesters 1 year ago? 10 years ago?

More easily placated or ignored by the authorities. Fortunately, mobs don't go full nuclear each and every time but require stoking and momentum building.

It requires an easily understandable injustice of some kind,  like videos circulating of those retarded cops killing the suspect while arresting him.

[Zero999]

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

I think that's part of it, but it also has the appearance of being largely an anti-capitalism and anti-authority movement. In my area much of what was going on felt just like the old Occupy movement that fizzled out several years ago. People capitalizing on a tragic event to get the masses on board with a movement that a lot of people otherwise wouldn't be on board with. It's far easier to drum up support when you can just call anyone who isn't a fanatical supporter a racist. Between the pandemic and other events there was a perfect storm that created a nearly ideal environment to try to cultivate a revolution. Like happened with the Occupy movement, I suspect it will get fragmented and fizzle out eventually. They start out with a noble goal but then it becomes chaotic and disorganized and more people try to piggyback their own pet agendas.

We need more moderates to stand up and say, it's possible to dissagree with the many of the BLM's objectives and thier behaviour without being racist.  Worryingly there seems to be a fair number of them who are extremists who hate white people. There are numerous videos of them harassing white people, getting them to apologise for being white. If they did that to me, I'd like to say, I'd tell them to bugger off, but in reality, I'd just ignore them, pretend I don't speak English, or something, to avoid being set upon by an angry mob.

The authorities need to clamp down on them for their criminal acts ranging from vandalism and theft, to breaking the rules on social distancing.

[SilverSolder]

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

I think that's part of it, but it also has the appearance of being largely an anti-capitalism and anti-authority movement. In my area much of what was going on felt just like the old Occupy movement that fizzled out several years ago. People capitalizing on a tragic event to get the masses on board with a movement that a lot of people otherwise wouldn't be on board with. It's far easier to drum up support when you can just call anyone who isn't a fanatical supporter a racist. Between the pandemic and other events there was a perfect storm that created a nearly ideal environment to try to cultivate a revolution. Like happened with the Occupy movement, I suspect it will get fragmented and fizzle out eventually. They start out with a noble goal but then it becomes chaotic and disorganized and more people try to piggyback their own pet agendas.

We need more moderates to stand up and say, it's possible to dissagree with the many of the BLM's objectives and thier behaviour without being racist.  Worryingly there seems to be a fair number of them who are extremists who hate white people. There are numerous videos of them harassing white people, getting them to apologise for being white. If they did that to me, I'd like to say, I'd tell them to bugger off, but in reality, I'd just ignore them, pretend I don't speak English, or something, to avoid being set upon by an angry mob.

The authorities need to clamp down on them for their criminal acts ranging from vandalism and theft, to breaking the rules on social distancing.

What stirred it all up, was videos of obscene police brutality against a black person being widely circulated.   You do get that, right?   We wouldn't be having this discussion if that hadn't happened.

[coppice]

None of that surprises me and don't get me started on the BML movement, who've lost all credability with many people. If they really cared about anyone's life, they wouldn't have acted in such a wrecless manner. They're mostly a load of pathetic social justice warriors who are pissed off because they've not been allowed to socialise during lockdown and needed a release. I'm all of wiping out racism, but this is not the way to do it.

I think that's part of it, but it also has the appearance of being largely an anti-capitalism and anti-authority movement. In my area much of what was going on felt just like the old Occupy movement that fizzled out several years ago. People capitalizing on a tragic event to get the masses on board with a movement that a lot of people otherwise wouldn't be on board with. It's far easier to drum up support when you can just call anyone who isn't a fanatical supporter a racist. Between the pandemic and other events there was a perfect storm that created a nearly ideal environment to try to cultivate a revolution. Like happened with the Occupy movement, I suspect it will get fragmented and fizzle out eventually. They start out with a noble goal but then it becomes chaotic and disorganized and more people try to piggyback their own pet agendas.

We need more moderates to stand up and say, it's possible to dissagree with the many of the BLM's objectives and thier behaviour without being racist.  Worryingly there seems to be a fair number of them who are extremists who hate white people. There are numerous videos of them harassing white people, getting them to apologise for being white. If they did that to me, I'd like to say, I'd tell them to bugger off, but in reality, I'd just ignore them, pretend I don't speak English, or something, to avoid being set upon by an angry mob.

The authorities need to clamp down on them for their criminal acts ranging from vandalism and theft, to breaking the rules on social distancing.

What stirred it all up, was videos of obscene police brutality against a black person being widely circulated.   You do get that, right?   We wouldn't be having this discussion if that hadn't happened.

No. What stirred it up was millions almost trapped in their homes for months until they were grumpy and ready for trouble. Many of us were just wondering what spark would actually trigger social unrest, especially as we moved into summer, when most rioting occurs. The video showing police brutality was just the right spark at the right time. Many other gruesome videos have come and gone without more than a little grumbling in the press. If George Floyd hadn't been killed there would have been something else to trigger rioting. Bad things happen with enough regularity there's always another just around the corner.

[maginnovision]

I definitely think the being locked up was a huge part. The other thing is this is one of the very few instances where BLM actually found an incident that was very clearly wrong. There are still some issues with it but he didn't have a gun, he didn't beat any cops... He was not actively endangering anyone the cops there just didn't seem to care and wanted him to be 100% complacent. He should have been too but if he was on drugs, and had his other issues I can see where the problems came from. Unlike most every other incident BLM rioted(no I can't use another word, there is ALWAYS violence in response) about though he wasn't going to hurt anyone and didn't even seem to have that intention. He sure as hell wasn't going to run away either.

You can see now virtually any police action is met with more protest or riots, more violence within the affected communities which is really awful. If the cops show up they'll be attacked or fired so they don't. The fact that BLM is an oxymoron doesn't help(they only care about blacks killed by police, most black lives they couldn't give a shit about). God help us(just a turn of phrase) this stuff is still going on if Donald Trump gets elected again... Or if Joe Biden is. We just need people to think logically for a minute relax and see what we can make happen and see if it does anything. However I think some of these potential "fixes" are bad like sending social workers to domestic incidents(the most unpredictable as they are VERY passionate incidents). Even if people do stop rioting and protesting and attacking vehicles I'm not sure how things get better at this point.

[SilverSolder]

A lot of things can be improved at relatively modest cost.  For domestic incidents, send trained police AND social worker(s), together.  Weed out bad cops from the force, incidents like we saw are unnecessary and should never occur with a modern professional police force in a democratic country.

What stirred it [the rioting] up was millions almost trapped in their homes for months until they were grumpy and ready for trouble. Many of us were just wondering what spark would actually trigger social unrest, especially as we moved into summer, when most rioting occurs. The video showing police brutality was just the right spark at the right time. Many other gruesome videos have come and gone without more than a little grumbling in the press. If George Floyd hadn't been killed there would have been something else to trigger rioting. Bad things happen with enough regularity there's always another just around the corner.

Are you saying it is OK to have a steady stream of injustices from an undisciplined and unprofessional police force as long as there are no riots?

[coppice]

A lot of things can be improved at relatively modest cost.  For domestic incidents, send trained police AND social worker(s), together.  Weed out bad cops from the force, incidents like we saw are unnecessary and should never occur with a modern professional police force in a democratic country.

Many countries have massively reduced support for those with mental issues in recent decades, like this magically makes them go away. The result is that much of the homeless population of major cities are people with mental health issues, who end up as troublemakers through no fault of their own. Instead of trained mental health professionals dealing with them, the police end up dealing with them. Not only are the police not trained for this, it must piss them off. I'm sure most of the police who deal with these problems feel sorry for the people they are dealing with, but there isn't much they can do. The last thing these people need is social workers. They need proper health professionals. This isn't cheap, through. The whole reason proper services were defunded is it saved a lot.

Frequently when one of these brutal videos gets picked up by the media it turns out the key policeman in the video has a track record of brutal treatment of suspects, typically being an equal opportunity thug who has beaten up suspects of all races. There seems to be much more an issue of rogue violent police in the US than racist ones. Blame the city governments. They oversee the police, and if they have not addressed these long term problems they clearly don't care. Right now we see so many US mayors acting like they are pawns in the game.

What stirred it [the rioting] up was millions almost trapped in their homes for months until they were grumpy and ready for trouble. Many of us were just wondering what spark would actually trigger social unrest, especially as we moved into summer, when most rioting occurs. The video showing police brutality was just the right spark at the right time. Many other gruesome videos have come and gone without more than a little grumbling in the press. If George Floyd hadn't been killed there would have been something else to trigger rioting. Bad things happen with enough regularity there's always another just around the corner.

Are you saying it is OK to have a steady stream of injustices from an undisciplined and unprofessional police force as long as there are no riots?

What a stupid response.

[PlainName]

Weed out bad cops from the force, incidents like we saw are unnecessary

Easier said than done. Before world+dog carried live cameras 24/7, any problem would basically boil down to the cop's word against whoever, and since the cop is notionally completely trustworthy (else he wouldn't be a cop) and the other person likely a perp (otherwise he wouldn't be nicked) it's obvious who is likely to be believed. The cop probably has backup from his colleagues too.

Also bear in mind that not every put upon person is playing a straight bat. Give your average tea leaf half and inch and he'll take all eight. The reason they are criminals is because they have no compunction about breaking the rules, so you'd expect a lot of complaints about the police to be malicious and/or just trying it on because there's nothing to lose.

The big problem has been that genuine grievances just got lost in the noise of routine petty point scoring. The difference now is that when someone falls down the stairs we might get to see them being pushed or tripped, although there have been famous cases of such being caught on camera and nothing being done about it. However, those tended to be isolated incidents so easily passed off as just a bad apple thing, whereas currently we're seeing that there are far more of these apples than we imagined.