What did you buy today? Post your latest purchase!

[tablatronix]

Why did I not buy this sooner, so much easier than plunger sucker.

[GreyWoolfe]

Why did I not buy this sooner, so much easier than plunger sucker.

So you think, young Grasshopper!   I had one for quite awhile.  Quite the pain in the keester.  Sucked poorly at removing solder, but did a real good job of burning me a few times.  Used it until I could afford better.  SWMBO asked, a couple of years ago, what I wanted for Christmas.  Santa brought me a ZD-985 desoldering pump.  Lots of funny looks from her, but, in my defense, she did ask.  When I threw mine in the trash, I cut the cord off of it so no one would try to use it.

[tablatronix]

I burnt 2 fingers already. This is until i get one of those, probably just a FR 300 handheld though.

[grumpydoc]

Well, the beast arrived this morning so I've just had a 1st look.

My initial thought was "wow that's big". My second though was "No, it's ******* enormous". On paper it's only a bit larger than the 9354 but in real life it seems to dwarf it. The fans are a bit loud as well - my 9354 is whisper quiet in comparison but I did change the fan on that. I believe that there are louder 'scopes but this does make its presence felt in no uncertain terms.

However I'm not at all sure changing the fans on the 950 would be a good idea - LeCroy ADC's are notoriously good at frying themselves without adequate airflow and this beast looks like it needs good airflow

Traces look normal enough. The inputs are wide open, so they might quiet down with something connected.

They are pretty noisy to be honest - the flat top of a square wave is a thick band about 0.2 divisions high at something like 1ms/div.

Grounding the input does not change things. Turning on the bandwidth limiter tames it especially the 20MHz limit (a bit unworkable for day to day use) but does not remove it completely, choosing a faster timebase makes it less noticeable. Both of these observations suggest that it is high frequency noise in the ADC input.

Using some averaging in the maths package removes it completely.

Is it too noisy, or unusually noisy?

Taking the latter point first - no, I don't think so. At least there are any number of photos of these 'scopes on the 'net (or the DDA260 variant) which show similar trace thickness. To be honest it is probably only slightly worse than the 9354, but it is visually much more prominent and I wonder whether this is in part due to the display technology and the slightly higher resolution of the 9354 display - 810 x 696pixels compared with 640x480.

Is it too noisy? Umm, yes it might be. Some things will help such as the BW limit and making sure it stays in 4Gs/s mode rather than switching automatically to 16Gs/s mode with only one channel (that makes it noisier) and I need to give the manual a thorough read (think I'll re-watch Dave's video on the subject as well) but I do find myself wondering whether I can actually live wit this as a day-to-day 'scope.

The LCD appears uneven and darker at the top. This is common for these scopes and their DDA and SDA variants. The culprit is a little reflector foil installed behind the backlight CFL tube. With age, it curls and partially obstructs the tube. The bottom of the screen is less affected because of increased light diffusion further from the tube.

It's not bad - maybe a little dimming in the top left corner but not enough to make me want to take it apart.

That video you linked was a bit frustrating because he did not show the appearance of the display before he took it out of the 'scope.

New displays still seem to be available around the $100 +/- $25 mark.

Photos in due course if I have time.


Changing subjects.....

So you think, young Grasshopper!   I had one for quite awhile.  Quite the pain in the keester.  Sucked poorly at removing solder, but did a real good job of burning me a few times.  Used it until I could afford better.  SWMBO asked, a couple of years ago, what I wanted for Christmas.  Santa brought me a ZD-985 desoldering pump.  Lots of funny looks from her, but, in my defense, she did ask.  When I threw mine in the trash, I cut the cord off of it so no one would try to use it.

+1 for something like the ZD-985 I have the "duratool" equivalent and it is a lifesaver for getting stuff off a board.

[tautech]

Is it too noisy, or unusually noisy?

Taking the latter point first - no, I don't think so. At least there are any number of photos of these 'scopes on the 'net (or the DDA260 variant) which show similar trace thickness. To be honest it is probably only slightly worse than the 9354, but it is visually much more prominent and I wonder whether this is in part due to the display technology and the slightly higher resolution of the 9354 display - 810 x 696pixels compared with 640x480.

Is it too noisy? Umm, yes it might be. Some things will help such as the BW limit and making sure it stays in 4Gs/s mode rather than switching automatically to 16Gs/s mode with only one channel (that makes it noisier) and I need to give the manual a thorough read (think I'll re-watch Dave's video on the subject as well) but I do find myself wondering whether I can actually live wit this as a day-to-day 'scope.

Watch both:
https://www.eevblog.com/2014/04/10/eevblog-601-why-digital-oscilloscopes-appear-noisy/
https://www.eevblog.com/2014/04/27/eevblog-610-why-digital-scopes-appear-noisy-part-2/

Moving to this class of instrument will be somewhat daunting to begin with but there are tools to help take the unneeded information from the trace.............you'll work it out.   

[NivagSwerdna]

@grumpydoc  Do create a thread for your experiments... I would be interested to see how you get on with your new beast of an instrument.

[grumpydoc]

Watch both:
https://www.eevblog.com/2014/04/10/eevblog-601-why-digital-oscilloscopes-appear-noisy/
https://www.eevblog.com/2014/04/27/eevblog-610-why-digital-scopes-appear-noisy-part-2/

Moving to this class of instrument will be somewhat daunting to begin with but there are tools to help take the unneeded information from the trace.............you'll work it out.   

Yeah, as I said above I needed to watch some of Dave's videos again - I knew he had covered this but could not quite put my finger on the details. In fact having watched about half of EEVblog #601 I realised I hadn't taken account of the much longer trace memory in this 'scope than my 9354.

Bingo - the acquisition was set to 100k points - a quick play with the 'scope confirms that bringing it down to something more reasonable reduces much of the noise, as expected.

At similar settings the trace noise is not that different from the MDO3104 in Dave's video.

It underlines the fact that you are going to do better on ebay if you understand what you are selling

@grumpydoc  Do create a thread for your experiments... I would be interested to see how you get on with your new beast of an instrument.

If I have time I will do some photos,

[MosherIV]

Just arrived today.......



Some solder
Bargin at £7.20 inculding postage. Cheapest I could get on ebay 

[djos]

Just arrived today.......



Some solder
Bargin at £7.20 inculding postage. Cheapest I could get on ebay 

What's it actually like to solder with tho? 

[bitseeker]

Yes, some impressions after use would be great. That's quite a bargain, but I'm wary.

[bjcuizon]

This:
(See attachment.)
Its a stripper/crimper at the same time.
Finally its not one of those cheap as ones.

[djos]

Yes, some impressions after use would be great. That's quite a bargain, but I'm wary.

My thoughts also, I'd have thought .9 mm is quite thick even for 1 mm through hole (i normally use .56 mm). That said, I could see it being useful for soldering physical mounting holes for connectors.

[bitseeker]

The size is slightly large, but I'd be OK with it. I'm more concerned about the wetting of solder joints. I wouldn't want to have to use lots of additional flux to get a good bond.

[TerraHertz]

Some solder

And a rare sighting of a glass CRT TV still in use. Yay CRTs! I like them too. The last of the actually maintainable video displays.

[djos]

The size is slightly large, but I'd be OK with it. I'm more concerned about the wetting of solder joints. I wouldn't want to have to use lots of additional flux to get a good bond.

It seems to say "cored" on it so I assume that is "Rosin Cored"?

[MosherIV]

What's it actually like to solder with tho? 

It solders just fine, this is good old 60/40 lead solder 
Its a bit smokey for my liking (thats the flux), lucky hay fever is supressing my sense of smell.
I scored a soldering fan earlier, for when I need it.

I do mostly through hole stuff at home so the .9mm is ok.

I will be on the look out for some more finer solder.

Im a cheap skate so I always love a bargin 

And a rare sighting of a glass CRT TV still in use. Yay CRTs! I like them too. The last of the actually maintainable video displays

errmm, yes could not find a flat surface to take the picture. I am sure many of you have filled every flat surface with test gear and random electronics stuff. Yes, apart from the 4x3 (yes it is that old) aspect ratio I like the tv. It actually has built in Dolby surround, I cannot be bothered to do the research in surround sound amps to replace the tv. In addition, I am the kind of person who will use something till it breaks, and even then I will try to fix it

[deflicted]

I am the kind of person who will use something till it breaks, and even then I will try to fix it

I'm the same way, especially with cars. Unfortunately, my wife is the exact opposite with cars. Soon as a car needs any repairs over $500, she starts thinking we need a new one. And it's not just with her car, but my daily driver as well. Then we always hash out the same old argument about ongoing repair costs for an older car vs going back to having a car payment. I can't stand having a car payment. I'll take an old jalopy that I'm constantly having to fix over having a car payment any day.

[SeanB]

I am the kind of person who will use something till it breaks, and even then I will try to fix it

I'm the same way, especially with cars. Unfortunately, my wife is the exact opposite with cars. Soon as a car needs any repairs over $500, she starts thinking we need a new one. And it's not just with her car, but my daily driver as well. Then we always hash out the same old argument about ongoing repair costs for an older car vs going back to having a car payment. I can't stand having a car payment. I'll take an old jalopy that I'm constantly having to fix over having a car payment any day.

Ask her ( if you dare) if you should trade her in for a new model as soon as any bill for anything she wants comes to over $500. No need to buy a new car while the old one still does the job, and does so for less per month than payments for a new car, which in any case is not an asset but a liability, and which is best bought as a year or three old one ( with service history) at a good discount.

[canibalimao]

I am the kind of person who will use something till it breaks, and even then I will try to fix it

I'm the same way, especially with cars. Unfortunately, my wife is the exact opposite with cars. Soon as a car needs any repairs over $500, she starts thinking we need a new one. And it's not just with her car, but my daily driver as well. Then we always hash out the same old argument about ongoing repair costs for an older car vs going back to having a car payment. I can't stand having a car payment. I'll take an old jalopy that I'm constantly having to fix over having a car payment any day.

Ask her ( if you dare) if you should trade her in for a new model as soon as any bill for anything she wants comes to over $500. No need to buy a new car while the old one still does the job, and does so for less per month than payments for a new car, which in any case is not an asset but a liability, and which is best bought as a year or three old one ( with service history) at a good discount.

I tottaly agree with you.

We should care a car as much as it can do the job it was intended to. I had a car in my family for 20 years. When the car reach its 15 years my fathers bought a new one and gave the old one to me. I only got a new one (a few weeks ago) when the repairs costs allways over 150€ (a new exaust pipe, a new clutch, a new MAF sensor, a new EGR valve, etc etc etc) and a couple of days in the repair shop. I have no conditions to be half a week without a car, so I really needed another one.

Unfortunatly I'm not like this with tools and gadgets. When it starts to fail I buy a new one and then fix the old  

[rdl]

I made the last payment on my truck in 2008. They had been about $275 a month. Since then, repairs and maintenance have totaled almost $1700, or about $16 per month. Of course, I don't drive much so that helps, but any vehicle that's paid off is far cheaper to own than a new one. You would have to be needing a serious major repair every year (motor, trans, etc.) before a new vehicle makes sense.

[deflicted]

I made the last payment on my truck in 2008. They had been about $275 a month. Since then, repairs and maintenance have totaled almost $1700, or about $16 per month. Of course, I don't drive much so that helps, but any vehicle that's paid off is far cheaper to own than a new one. You would have to be needing a serious major repair every year (motor, trans, etc.) before a new vehicle makes sense.

This is what I try to explain to my wife, but even though she has a business logistics degree and is no slouch at math, she's not swayed by the "do the math" argument. Instead, she insists that once a car starts needing "major" repairs (which as I said in her mind is anything over $500 or so), it's all downhill from there and the car just becomes a money pit. She's always afraid that we're going to throw $500 or $1000 at it, then next month something else is going to break, etc, and that therefore you shouldn't throw any money at it whatsoever. Of course, this all excludes regular maintenance things like brake repairs. If we have to spend $800 to fix the brakes because the calipers are shot, she doesn't think anything of it, but if the fuel pump goes bad after 140k miles, she thinks it's an indication that the whole car is shot. I tell her parts are parts, and none of them last forever, and what's the difference between a brake caliper and a fuel pump in that regard? Neither of those things needing to be replaced means that the whole car is shot. But it's all lost on her. I really think it just comes down to fear of the unknown for her. The difference between brake calipers and a fuel pump, in her mind, is that she has a basic understanding of how brakes work, and what a bad brake caliper does or doesn't imply about the health of the rest of the car. But a fuel pump is a mystery to her. In her mind, the fuel pump is an "engine" part (even though on most cars these days it's located in the fuel tank), and if an "engine" part is going bad, what else is going on with the engine that just hasn't hit us yet? Oh, crap, dump it!

[grumpydoc]

I made the last payment on my truck in 2008. They had been about $275 a month. Since then, repairs and maintenance have totaled almost $1700, or about $16 per month. Of course, I don't drive much so that helps, but any vehicle that's paid off is far cheaper to own than a new one. You would have to be needing a serious major repair every year (motor, trans, etc.) before a new vehicle makes sense.

This is what I try to explain to my wife.................. Oh, crap, dump it!

The problem is that sometimes you need a crystal ball to know what to do.

I drive an '06 Celica - it had an "expensive patch" in 2015 having blown a hole in the power steering fluid cooler, the clutch finally gave out and needed replacing and the following service saw new disks and pads all round as well as new rubber on all four corners. I think it cost me £2k that year.

But it's settled down and hasn't needed anything major since then so, while I would love an new motor I can't really justify the expense and am happy to keep the Toyota running. It helps that they are generally recognised as a reliable marque.

The "family" car, however, was an '05 Saab. As this was from an era when Saab built to a specification not a price (and went bankrupt as a consequence) you would think it ought to be OK. Unfortunately it had started to become unreliable, breaking the main drive belt more than once and I suspect our mechanic had not quite got to the bottom of why. As the belt drives the power steering pump failure left my wife without power steering rather suddenly and she does not have the physical strength to handle the car without - so it all got a bit frightening.

Just before Xmas 2015 it blew the turbo. I got that fixed as we were due to travel in it and I did not want to be forced to buy a new motor in a hurry but decided that enough was enough. Just before we picked up the replacement and on the day I was going to list the Saab on ebay it threw its belt again as well as half the sump contents onto the road.

That car felt like it was going to be a) a serious money pit and b) unreliable which is a bigger problem when you need to use it every day.

Had I had a working crystal ball I might well have sold it after the first broken drive belt.

Yes, I know, had I held faith etc etc. I'm not buying it

[deflicted]

Yes, I know, had I held faith etc etc.

Just to be clear, this is not at all the point I was making, nor one I ever would make. My wife's default position about a car that's starting to need repairs is to immediately assume it's a money pit. But that doesn't mean my default position is to assume it's all fine and dandy, or have "faith" in it just needing this one part and then everything will be perfect.

Rather, I think your examples clearly demonstrate that neither thing can be logically concluded early on when the car is just starting to need repairs. But if it's just the one thing, for now, and the car has otherwise been reliable, even a few $500 repairs need not be cause for alarm. Instead, you just keep an eye on it, and watch out for red flags. In the case of your Saab, the repeated belt failures were a huge red flag (barring you or your mechanic being able to identify a root cause such as a bad pulley or some such thing).

Bottom line, there's a risk associated with either course of action. If you rush to the conclusion that the car is junk and immediately sell it, the risk is that you're potentially giving up a perfectly good car that just needs a few repairs. On the other hand, if you assume the car is good (like homeowners who insist their dump of a house has "good bones") and keep throwing money at it for expensive repairs, and it might actually end up being a money pit. The only sensible thing to do is keep your wits about you and take it one repair at a time. Reason it out, weigh the evidence, do the math, consider the best and worst case scenarios and try to arrive at an educated guess as to where your car falls in between those lines. And then the next time something breaks, do it all over again.

In my most recent case, I had a Ford Explorer with about 140k miles on it that had been amazingly reliable. I never had to do anything to it other than the regular service intervals, and the occasional expensive brake job. The engine was remarkably strong given how many miles it had on it, and how hard I drove it. Then the fuel pump went out and started intermittently leaving me stranded. I did some basic electrical troubleshooting to rule out things like a short or open wire, or a bad ground point, and everything pointed back to the fuel pump itself. It would have cost me around $400 to do the job myself, or $800 to have the mechanic fix it. I have all the tools necessary to do the job, the only thing that I was a little wary about was dealing with proper and safe removal of the fuel tank. But I always err on the side of being overly cautious, and I was confident I could get it off safely. By my wife wasn't having it. To her, as I said, a bad fuel pump meant the engine was going bad, and she was convinced that this was just the beginning of a cascade of failures. To me, it was a fuel pump with 140k miles on it that was probably only engineered to last 100k miles, and in fact I had found numerous threads on various forums about Ford Explorer fuel pumps going out, with nearly identical symptoms. There were even step by step repair guides, videos on YouTube, etc specifically dealing with replacing the fuel pump on Ford Explorers.

As an aside, evidently a lot of people just cut a hole from inside the passenger compartment in order to get access to the fuel pump without having to drop the tank. Way too scary for me to attempt. I'm sure I'd be that one guy who blew himself up by accidentally cutting into the fuel tank with an angle grinder.

[deflicted]

But hey, let's get this thread back on topic. Today I received the much talked about UNI-T 210E in the mail.

In fairness, I've had my eye on this for quite a while now, long before I discovered EEVBLOG. Oddly enough, this actually dovetails with the car repair tangent, since I was first drawn to the 210E back when I was troubleshooting a battery drain on the previously mentioned Ford Explorer. I was looking for an affordable DC current clamp so I could monitor current draw with the car off, but without having to put my poor ol' Radio Shack DMM in series in order to measure it.

Hopefully, I won't need it to diagnose any car electric woes any time soon, but I'd love to be able to take quick current measurements on the bench just as a sanity check, without the hassle of putting a meter in series.

[Cubdriver]

<big snip for brevity>

As an aside, evidently a lot of people just cut a hole from inside the passenger compartment in order to get access to the fuel pump without having to drop the tank. Way too scary for me to attempt. I'm sure I'd be that one guy who blew himself up by accidentally cutting into the fuel tank with an angle grinder.

Angle grinder.  Bleh!!   

Seems like a good excuse to get one of these:  https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/nonsense-post-plasma-cutter/

 

-Pat