SmarterEveryDay #134

[dexters_lab]

Been subbed to the SmarterEveryDay channel for a long time now, i always enjoyed this videos but this latest episode really irked me to the point of ubsubscribing...

...to be honest i have been getting pretty tired of his annoying product promotion/advertising recently, but right at the end of this particular episode is a some particular text in the titles which reads "Psalm 111:2" 

so thats it, i'm unsubscribed

in any case, the whole episode is a rip-off of what mike did two years ago on his channel

[lutkeveld]

Are you for real? You mean the Ford 'sponsorspot' in the acoustic levitation video?
Without them  he wouldn't even be able to go there and make the video.
Thanking them at the end of the video is the least he could do.

[ajb]

He's had the bible verse thing at the end of his videos for a while--long as I've been watching in fact.  Given that the actual content of the videos is entirely secular and usually scientific in nature, and whenever I've looked up the referenced bible verses they've been pretty inoffensive, I have a hard time seeing why anyone would have a problem with it.  I mean, it'd be different if he brought religion into the videos themselves, or if the referenced verses were something morally problematic.  As it is, I really don't give a shit. 

Psalm 111:2, by the way, is "Great are the works of the Lord; they are pondered by all who delight in them".  Clearly this is a guy who is religious in a way that at least is compatible with--if not outright encouraging--a desire for deeper understanding of the world.  Hard to take issue with that.

As for the ads, well, if it helps him keep making videos, they're okay by me, although I haven't watched the last couple videos yet.  Still better than TV commercials!

[rollatorwieltje]

...to be honest i have been getting pretty tired of his annoying product promotion/advertising recently, but right at the end of this particular episode is a some particular text in the titles which reads "Psalm 111:2" 

It's on pretty much all of his videos, at least since the last 2 years or so.

Personally I'm getting more tired of those Squarespace / Audible / Harry's / whatever ads, they are everywhere and every host seems to be using those services personally... Right. I understand the money has to come from somewhere, but really...

[nitro2k01]

Eh, what? It's hardly a rip-off of Mike's video. Mike made his own levitator from an ultrasonic cleaner and whatever he had in his lab. It was an exercise in creative engineering. This video approached it more from a pop science angle and was using a purpose-built levitation controller and high speed cameras filming colorful drops of water. They're both videos on ultrasonic levitation, but completely different focus. If you want to talk about rip-offs, criticize the dickwad CrazyRussianHacker.

I will say that I too was slightly irked the first time I noticed the Bible references, but I'm trying tell myself that at least he's competent in science and engineering, and the religious content is limited to 1 second of each video and 1% of the screen area.

[dexters_lab]

right, just me then!

maybe its the way he drops the adverts in that winds me up

[PeterFW]

maybe its the way he drops the adverts in that winds me up

You know what grinds my gears?
People who have to tell "I unsubscribed." as a comment, utterly useless.

And before you ask... i do not like the guy, there is something off about him.
But i am subscribed to the channel, once every blue moon there is something interesting on there.

[george graves]

so thats it, i'm unsubscribed

I'm sure he could not care less.  It's his videos, he can put what ever he wants on them.  You're welcome to watch them or not. But you trying to penalize him by starting this thread because he believes in something you don't, is childish at best.

Let me put it this way.  Who would I rather be stuck next to on a long flight?  The guy that goes around and says "Waaaaa!!!!  I'm going to unsubscribe!", or a very pleasant person, intelligent person, that I might learn something from?

[zapta]

right, just me then!

maybe its the way he drops the adverts in that winds me up

... or maybe it challenges your view of religious people.

[Dave]

He's doing something to make science appealing to the average Joe. There may be a tiny fragment of his viewers that end up pursuing a career in science/engineering, because they are motivated by his videos. Anyone that does that is alright in my book.

I've noticed those bible quotes at the ends of his videos a long time ago. As long as he doesn't start blabbing about his religious views in the videos themselves, I don't mind them at all.

[EEVblog]

...to be honest i have been getting pretty tired of his annoying product promotion/advertising recently, but right at the end of this particular episode is a some particular text in the titles which reads "Psalm 111:2" 

I saw that too and was pretty disappointed. I gather he's heavily religious?
I still like his stuff of course.
A few of the science youtubers have gone the in-video advertising route, either Audible (who approached me also), or some other company.
I know a few electronics bloggers (including myself) who have turned down big money to have in-video ads.

[EEVblog]

I'm sure he could not care less.  It's his videos, he can put what ever he wants on them.  You're welcome to watch them or not. But you trying to penalize him by starting this thread because he believes in something you don't, is childish at best.

No it's not, it's called raising a discussion, that's what forums are for.

[EEVblog]

You know what grinds my gears?
People who have to tell "I unsubscribed." as a comment, utterly useless.

It's not to a content producer, it tells you why people are unsubscribing and that can be useful info should you chose to care about such things and use that info.

[dexters_lab]

i dont fault what he shows in his videos aside from the shameless plugs and product placements

i wonder though, here in the UK the level of advertising is much less than in other parts of the world so maybe i just notice it more!

as for the bible references in the titles, i hadn't noticed it before and if it's been there a while well maybe i should tolerate it?

[ajb]

as for the bible references in the titles, i hadn't noticed it before and if it's been there a while well maybe i should tolerate it?

A better question to ask is why you wouldn't tolerate it.  Is the slightest reference to religion that repugnant to you?  I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just honestly don't understand why things like this provoke such a strong reaction.  Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?

Personally I prefer to avoid lumping people into a binary rational/nutcase classification.  There's a whole spectrum of religion between Dawkins and Ken Ham, and the inability to acknowledge that sort of spectrum of experience is a fundamental underpinning of every sort of human conflict.

[Mechanical Menace]

Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?

I think, like the advertising, it's a societal thing. Brits don't tend to be as... overly open about our particular religious stances unless it's directly related to the subject at hand. Not that we aren't just as happy to identify ourselves by our beliefs or have arguments about them but the video had nothing to do with religion in the slightest so we wouldn't expect a religious/atheistic/whatever slogan to be tagged on for no reason.

[dexters_lab]

as for the bible references in the titles, i hadn't noticed it before and if it's been there a while well maybe i should tolerate it?

A better question to ask is why you wouldn't tolerate it.  Is the slightest reference to religion that repugnant to you?  I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just honestly don't understand why things like this provoke such a strong reaction.  Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?

Personally I prefer to avoid lumping people into a binary rational/nutcase classification.  There's a whole spectrum of religion between Dawkins and Ken Ham, and the inability to acknowledge that sort of spectrum of experience is a fundamental underpinning of every sort of human conflict.

i think it's about balance, it seems acceptable to put some kind of religious content on the end of videos... but how would people feel if someone was quoting Dawkins at the end of their videos? What reaction would they receive?

[EEVblog]

A better question to ask is why you wouldn't tolerate it.  Is the slightest reference to religion that repugnant to you?  I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just honestly don't understand why things like this provoke such a strong reaction.  Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?

For me, when I first saw it, I was:
a) Very surprised
b) Very disappointed

If it was any other normal youtube channel, then meh, whatever, they're a Yank, I get it 
But this is a science channel, and to find bible quotes at the end of the videos leaves me feeling a bit dismayed. It's like having the science content polluted with a little bit of religion. If there is one place you (atheists who care about such things anyway) don't expect, nor want to find any reference to religion, it's in science content. To mention a channel who's name and slogan is Smarter Every Day. Even the book ad recommendations he gives at the end are desinged to make you Smarter Every Day, and then wham, you get hit with a bible proverb 
Indeed, many people seek out such science content because we know it's going to religion free, kinda like a place you can confidently go to escape all the religion in the world.
So I can understand why others might find it more than enough to unsubscribe.
I haven't unsubscribed, as I still like his stuff and totally support him creating it, but his stock did drop a few points when I saw it.

[dexters_lab]

A better question to ask is why you wouldn't tolerate it.  Is the slightest reference to religion that repugnant to you?  I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just honestly don't understand why things like this provoke such a strong reaction.  Maybe some people just assume that someone can't have the slightest bit of religion in them without turning into a bible thumping fundamentalist who wants to take us back to the stone age?

For me, when I first saw it, I was:
a) Very surprised
b) Very disappointed

If it was any other normal youtube channel, then meh, whatever, they're a Yank, I get it 
But this is a science channel, and to find bible quotes at the end of the videos leaves me feeling a bit dismayed. It's like having the science content polluted with a little bit of religion. If there is one place you (atheists who care about such things anyway) don't expect, nor want to find any reference to religion, it's in science content. To mention a channel who's name and slogan is Smarter Every Day. Even the book ad recommendations he gives at the end are desinged to make you Smarter Every Day, and then wham, you get hit with a bible proverb 
Indeed, many people seek out such science content because we know it's going to religion free, kinda like a place you can confidently go to escape all the religion in the world.
So I can understand why others might find it more than enough to unsubscribe.
I haven't unsubscribed, as I still like his stuff and totally support him creating it, but his stock did drop a few points when I saw it.

excellent points and sums up pretty much how i feel about it

[george graves]

For me, when I first saw it, I was:
a) Very surprised
b) Very disappointed

Go take a look at what we're talking about  -  watch one of his videos.  Take this one for example (I picked one at random)



It's literally 2 seconds....and not at the end of the video - no, it's way past the end.  It's even past the end of the "also watch these video" that plays for another 60 seconds...(you should start doing that as well! - apparently it works).  It's on screen from 10:03 to 10:05.  ~2 seconds.

Dave you've ranted about being an atheist for (collectively) hours.  I don't want to put words in your mouth....but what your saying is that you're so offended by someone that has a religion, that you look down upon them? "Very disappointed" in what?  His he not as good of a scientist now that you know this?

You don't think that you can believe in science and God at the same time?   And who are you to judge?

I'm sure he could not care less.  It's his videos, he can put what ever he wants on them.  You're welcome to watch them or not. But you trying to penalize him by starting this thread because he believes in something you don't, is childish at best.

No it's not, it's called raising a discussion, that's what forums are for.

Sure, it's a discussion a 5 year old would have.  It's usually called "Screw you guys, I'm taking my ball and going home"

A discussion would be sending a him a message, and saying "Hey, I don't like your bible verse - loose it or I'm going to unsuscribe".  And he would say, "Sorry - it's part of who I am and you're welcome to unsubscribe" - and that would be the end of the conservation.  This is totally different.

[mikeselectricstuff]

Dave you've ranted about being an atheist for (collectively) hours.  I don't want to put words in your mouth....but what your saying is that you're so offended by someone that has a religion, that you look down upon them? "Very disappointed" in what?  His he not as good of a scientist now that you know this?

You don't think that you can believe in science and God at the same time?   And who are you to judge?

Science is all about discovery via repeatable, objective evidence. A belief in something based on nothing more  than cultural traditions and writing from an era when nobody knew any better can only  undermine credibility as a scientist.

[Mechanical Menace]

A discussion would be sending a him a message, and saying "Hey, I don't like your bible verse - loose it or I'm going to unsuscribe".  And he would say, "Sorry - it's part of who I am and you're welcome to unsubscribe" - and that would be the end of the conservation.  This is totally different.

Erm are you saying there's only him who we're allowed to have discussions about his videos with? Would you agree with that if the criticism was purely positive? Should Dave only share his review videos with the manufacturers? I think you're arguing that if he has anything negative to say he should...

Me personally I'm not just not bothered by the the pointer towards a line of scripture but think the  passage chosen helps show a very common and damaging false dichotomy to be such, the idea pushed by many religious fundamentalists that you have to make a choice, science or religion. But that doesn't mean others have no right to criticise the choice and do it publicly.

Science is all about discovery via repeatable, objective evidence. A belief in something based on nothing more  than cultural traditions and writing from an era when nobody knew any better can only  undermine credibility as a scientist.

That would be fair if say all Christians believed the same thing and that belief hadn't changed since the religions conception, but that's not the case. Many a "soldier" on the pro-science, pro-secularism side of the anti-science argument are strong believers who's particular personal interpretation of the religion sees no incompatibility between the two subjects. I may strongly disagree with their reasoning that the areas don't overlap but if it doesn't effect their professional impartiality what's the problem?

[george graves]

Science is all about discovery via repeatable, objective evidence. A belief in something based on nothing more  than cultural traditions and writing from an era when nobody knew any better can only  undermine credibility as a scientist.

Your fallacy is that the two are mutually exclusive.

[EEVblog]

Go take a look at what we're talking about  -  watch one of his videos.

I know exactly where it is, I subscribe to him and back him.

Dave you've ranted about being an atheist for (collectively) hours.  I don't want to put words in your mouth....but what your saying is that you're so offended

You just did put words into my mouth 
Show me were I said I was offended?

by someone that has a religion, that you look down upon them? "Very disappointed" in what?

The fact that he puts bible quotes at the end of science videos.

  His he not as good of a scientist now that you know this?

Did I ever say he wasn't?
Nope, trying to put words into my mouth again.

You don't think that you can believe in science and God at the same time?

Have I ever said that?
Nope, trying to put words into my mouth again.
Of course people can, people are free to believe whatever they want, and I'll fight for that right.

   And who are you to judge?

It's called an opinion, get over it.

A discussion would be sending a him a message, and saying "Hey, I don't like your bible verse - loose it or I'm going to unsuscribe".  And he would say, "Sorry - it's part of who I am and you're welcome to unsubscribe" - and that would be the end of the conservation.  This is totally different.

Yeah, it's called having a little rant and starting a public discussion.
You do it all the time.

[george graves]

I love how you pick and choose what I say- but don't get to the real conservation.  I can 1 for 1 you too.  It's easy to do.

I sent him a link to this thread - he just might reply.  Now - that might be a real conservation - no?

Or have him on the amp-hour?  No?