How much does university prestige matter for employers and salary?

[geratheg]

I'm from California and got accepted in the UC Berkeley (ranked #2 or #3 public school for EECS just below Stanford and MIT) and another school is UC Davis (ranked around #30 for EE or ECE) as a transfer student. UCB seems more expensive and competitive in coursework but is one of the most prestigious universities. UCD is closer and cheaper. I'm more likely to get a better GPA from UCD than from UCB. I plan on going up to a MS degree.

1. How much does it matter about the prestige when it comes to industry?
2. Will there be a difference salaries, where UCB students would generally get higher pay than UCD students in the same job position?
3. What about in terms of being more likely to be employed?
4. Suppose two resumes are equal except one says their education is from UCB and the other from UCD, which would you hire?

If anyone knows anything or has experience with any of those schools please respond with your suggestions.

[Sigmoid]

Outside the US, a respectable state university and a big name carry pretty much the same prestige. I'm not that familiar with US state of affairs, I'm working here on a coporate transfer, and didn't notice any bias based on university prestige -we had hires from state universities and rejected applications from Yale -, so maybe this is the case throughout the technology field...

I do hear from people working in finance that university prestige is everything in that sector though...

[AG6QR]

The answer is a big fat "it depends".

You're asking how it enters into the decision-making process of the person or people who will be making the hiring and salary decision at some point in your future.  Those are individual people, with their own individual biases and opinions, and it's impossible to predict exactly how those individuals will weigh the various factors.

Having said that, here are a few general observations:

University education details matter much more for someone who has very recently graduated than for someone who has been out of school for a few years.  After a while, your work record is the only thing that matters.

If you're graduating with a MS, the reputation of your grad school is much more important than the reputation of your undergraduate school.

If the people doing the hiring have direct experience with graduates of the university or universities in question, they're more likely to have an opinion about the program.  To be more specific to your example, most people at large high tech employers in the SF Bay Area will probably know a few graduates of Stanford and UCB, and perhaps UCD.  Their opinions of the program will likely be colored by their opinions of the individual alumni they know, for better or worse.  While there may be trends toward one program producing better graduates than others, there will be outliers and exceptions to those trends.  Here's hoping the alumni of your school who go before you make a positive impression at your future workplace.  Better yet, here's hoping the people interviewing and hiring you graduated from the same school you'll be attending!

Most people with much industry experience are aware that school reputation isn't everything.  They've encountered good and bad co-workers from various universities.  On the other hand, when you're a fresh graduate applying for your first job, during the first cut at a quick interview, they don't have an awful lot of other things to go on.   So it doesn't hurt to be graduating from a school with a great reputation.

[LabSpokane]

In the US, pedigree matters. 

If you're going for a masters and beyond, your demeanor and work ethic will actually mean as much as your grades. That will be the key in getting faculty references for a position that pays you versus a masters program that you must pay for.

And as previously stated, your masters or PhD institution matters most, but your undergrad institution will help get you in the door. The BS is the new high school diploma, so don't expect anyone to be overly impressed with your undergraduate institution no matter what it's name.

[free_electron]

for a good company : no impact.

but, there's something that bothers me in your question. What are you after ? a good education , or a high paying job, or a job you are genuinely interest in doing ?

Good education can be had from different , non pedigree , schools.
high paying job ? become a slideware creator or marketing dude.

[JBaughb]

for a good company : no impact.

but, there's something that bothers me in your question. What are you after ? a good education , or a high paying job, or a job you are genuinely interest in doing ?

Good education can be had from different , non pedigree , schools.
high paying job ? become a slideware creator or marketing dude.

That's not fair. Its a worthwhile question asking people in the industry what their experiences are with hiring and university prestige. One can have interest in getting a job they're interested in while still having a desire to live comfortably.

[IanB]

Short answers:

1. How much does it matter about the prestige when it comes to industry?

In engineering, not much. How you come across at interview will be far more important.

2. Will there be a difference salaries, where UCB students would generally get higher pay than UCD students in the same job position?

There will be are greater variations in salary with location, industry, and type of job. You don't get paid for where you came from, you get paid for what you can do.

3. What about in terms of being more likely to be employed?

Again, that's all about you. There's a bit of luck in finding opportunities, but turning opportunities into job offers is about "closing the deal", in other words how you come across at interview.

4. Suppose two resumes are equal except one says their education is from UCB and the other from UCD, which would you hire?

I wouldn't care much about it. I care about who you are, what you have done, and what you can do.

One suggestion to make is to lower your costs and minimize debt while being a student. It's not likely you will recover higher costs with a higher salary later on.

Also consider that research oriented schools may not offer the best teaching for undergraduates. Get your BS from a school with a good teaching record and get your PhD from a school with a good research pedigree.

[Richard Crowley]

In my company, they have their "short list" of favorite schools where they concentrate most of their recruiting.
Although that doesn't mean that if you from some other school they won't still give you due consideration.

[suicidaleggroll]

In my company, as long as it's a real 4-year university (not ITT, Devry, etc.) then it doesn't really matter, it depends on the individual's skillset and how they come across in the interview.

[mtdoc]

Congratulations on your acceptances! It's good to have choices.

I can't answer your question for engineering.  But in the academic and basic science research world, university pedigree does play a role at the graduate school level and beyond. Undergrad not so much.

I'm from California and got accepted in the UC Berkeley (ranked #2 or #3 public school for EECS just below Stanford and MIT) and another school is UC Davis (ranked around #30 for EE or ECE) as a transfer student. UCB seems more expensive and competitive in coursework but is one of the most prestigious universities. UCD is closer and cheaper. I'm more likely to get a better GPA from UCD than from UCB. I plan on going up to a MS degree.

Why do you say UCD is cheaper? Do you mean living expenses?  It's been several years now since I was part of the UC system but it used to be that "fees" were the same across all campuses.  Perhaps that's changed.

If anyone knows anything or has experience with any of those schools please respond with your suggestions.

It may not be directly related to your question but since I spent several years as a research associate and lecturer at UCB I can say it's a great campus to be part of, with incredible opportunities for both on and on campus eductation.

I would not ignore the "non-academic" aspects of unverstiy education as well.  I don't have much experience with UCD per se (though I almost went to med school there) but I have spent time in Davis.  It's a nice small university town but outside of the university itself - not much going on there.

Then again - sometimes it is better to be a big fish in a small pond...

Unless the working engineers here tell you that your job prospects will be much better at the more prestigous university, I would focus on all aspects of your university experience since I'm sure you will get an excellent engineering education at either school.

[JBaughb]

Why do you say UCD is cheaper? Do you mean living expenses?  It's been several years now since I was part of the UC system but it used to be that "fees" were the same across all campuses.  Perhaps that's changed.

Its gotta be living expenses. Berkeley is a much more expensive town to live in compared to Davis.

[Galaxyrise]

when you're a fresh graduate applying for your first job, during the first cut at a quick interview, they don't have an awful lot of other things to go on.

I'd like to expand on that point: Give yourself other things the employer can go on:  clubs, competitions, side projects, etc.  If one of those schools doesn't give you those opportunities and enough time to do them, you will likely be served better by the school that does.  Internships can be amazing.

I've never seen GPA matter in the workplace, but your undergraduate GPA can be a factor in which graduate program you attend.

[PedroDaGr8]

As I was advised by a VP of a petrochemical company, someone has to justify your hiring to someone else. Deserved or not, school name caries an implicit weight in these kinds of discussions. You can easily overcome the school bias by having a good resume, but it is even easier on the hiring manager when they don't have to defend the school. Some will be lazy and not want to put up the fight, for these people they will say "But he went to XXX". For the others, school name will not matter as much.

[tytower]

I'll throw this in just because it is true .

When you go through Uni no matter what you do , you are pressured to learn parrot fashion and reproduce that on a final test.

You don''t get time to consider what you have been taught until well after the graduation year. Only then will you gain experience and real knowledge comes from experience only.
Thats why your experience matters much more to an employer. Money is commensurate with experience .

[Tinkerer]

For most schools, it doesnt matter.

The only time the school matters is if its something like MIT or Harvard or a school on the opposite end of the spectrum. All the schools in between seem to basically have the same effect.

[all_repair]

Is about what kind of friends you going to meet?  And maybe the spouse you can meet.

[steverino]

No question an EE Degree from Berkeley will get you more attention than an a degree from UC Davis.  Berkeley is a highly desired and highly competitive school.  Congratulations on being accepted! UC Davis is renowned for its agriculture and life science programs.  You may be equally educated at both engineering programs (I'm biased towards Berkeley), but when two resumes are on a hiring manager's desk, guess which one floats to the top.  My nephew earned his EE BS at Berkeley, got a job, and completed his Masters degree on the employer's dime. 

[eas]

I can't speak specifically to the comparison of Berkley and Davis, but I do have some perspective on the general question of choosing between an elite school and one with less prestige.

A couple years ago I got into an argument on another forum with someone who insisted that an undergrad degree from MIT made a huge difference compared to a good smaller, but lesser known school (Harvey Mudd) that attracted similarly qualified students. I dug up some salary studies comparing MIT, Harvey Mudd, and a number of other engineering schools, and what do you know, the difference between Mudd and MIT was minor in early, mid and late career.

A study of people admitted to elite colleges across disciplines found that, pretty much universally, people who made the cut for an elite school, but ended up attending a less elite school for some reason, did as well in their working life as the graduates of those elite colleges. The exception was people from poorer families, often first in their family to go to college. In that group, the elite schools seemed to provide an advantage.

Its certainly true that some hiring managers will give you more consideration because you went to Berkley, and there may be other advantages, but that isn't the whole story. One obvious difference is that Davis is going to cost you less money. That could mean less time working, more time for studying and working on projects with your peers. It could mean substantially less debt at graduation, and therefore more flexibility about the jobs you take in your first 5-10 years after school.

Oh, also, consider that a hiring manager that skips over a well qualified grad from a lesser school for one from a top school because he/she finds it easier to justify may well be the kind of manager who can't defend their staff against unreasonable schedules, budgets, requirements (ie, a terrible manager to work for).

Congratulations on your acceptances! It's good to have choices.

I can't answer your question for engineering.  But in the academic and basic science research world, university pedigree does play a role at the graduate school level and beyond. Undergrad not so much.

True, but not universally, particularly in this era. A friend from undergrad went to a second tier research university for his life science PhD, and now has a nice lab at a top-tier research university. In his telling, at the second tier university, he had the chance to learn how to be a researcher -- design experiments, write grants, take the lead on papers, the whole ball of wax. At a top tier university, he would have been a cog in a machine. As a result of his choice, he was able to build his career at a time when so many PhDs are having trouble even scoring a job in academic research.

[Galenbo]

4. Suppose two resumes are equal except one says their education is from UCB and the other from UCD, which would you hire?

In big organisations, it often depends on the guy who hires. Is he from UCD ?

[EEVblog]

On the other hand, when you're a fresh graduate applying for your first job, during the first cut at a quick interview, they don't have an awful lot of other things to go on.

In that case you are doing it wrong!
If you have nothing else to offer but your grades and what school you went to, then you are going to get walloped by the person that brings along all their side projects to the interview. No matter how good you are, graduates with the same degree and grades as you will be a dime a dozen.

[XFDDesign]

In that case you are doing it wrong!
If you have nothing else to offer but your grades and what school you went to, then you are going to get walloped by the person that brings along all their side projects to the interview. No matter how good you are, graduates with the same degree and grades as you will be a dime a dozen.

Pretty much this.

What ultimately matters is how you can differentiate yourself. You need to think of your employer as a customer. You're selling your services to them. Someone earlier said that it wasn't fair to ask if the OP is shopping for the most money, or the best way to get into the field of interest. It's perfectly fair, because if someone is expecting the simple fact of what school they attended to do the grunt of the work at getting them hired, they're only doing themselves a disservice. The school you choose should be chosen for its ability to facilitate your existing interest in a particular field of study. If you cannot afford such a school, then pursue that interest seperately while you work on the fundamentals that the school can teach you.

At my place of employment, they exclusively shop MIT for IC design engineers. We've had a few real stinkers that didn't last, while some of our best designers either didn't come from those places, or worked their way into a design role from product engineering. We used to shop Berkley too, but once we found that the PhD's started using standard templates for thesis dissertations and were mostly walked through it by the profs, we've removed them from the priority list.

If I personally have the position to hire someone, I have no interest in your piece of paper. I'm going to flat out ask you, "show me what you have done." I want to see the kinds of problems that interest you, and I want to see how you've solved those problems. I want to see how you manage projects while dealing with your other daily obligations. All of these things are ultimately not something that is handed to you from a papermill. They are a function of your character. If I want a robot who simply repeats motions of existing, solved, problems I can pick up someone from over seas for a song; but I have no need for robots.

[LabSpokane]

I think there needs to be a differentiation between getting the job and getting an interview. With the automated systems used in the US, getting the interview is based on the text of your resume matching keywords.

Once one gets the interview, then the bonus credentials can help.

[free_electron]

for a good company : no impact.

but, there's something that bothers me in your question. What are you after ? a good education , or a high paying job, or a job you are genuinely interest in doing ?

Good education can be had from different , non pedigree , schools.
high paying job ? become a slideware creator or marketing dude.

That's not fair. Its a worthwhile question asking people in the industry what their experiences are with hiring and university prestige. One can have interest in getting a job they're interested in while still having a desire to live comfortably.

My question is what are you after ?

the university that gets you the best paid job ?
the university that gives you the best education ?

Feynman already wrota bout that. One university had a gold plated particle accelerator that students were allowed to look at but not touch, another university had a dumpy machine in a dark cellar, leaking coolant and held together by duct tape.
Guess which one published the most research papers and did the most discoveries ?

So what do you want ? Knowledge or Money ? Yyou can have both, i never said that was not popssible. The question is :what do you go for first ? and that will tell me what i am dealing with ...

[LabSpokane]

In that case you are doing it wrong!
If you have nothing else to offer but your grades and what school you went to, then you are going to get walloped by the person that brings along all their side projects to the interview. No matter how good you are, graduates with the same degree and grades as you will be a dime a dozen.

Pretty much this.

What ultimately matters is how you can differentiate yourself. You need to think of your employer as a customer. You're selling your services to them. Someone earlier said that it wasn't fair to ask if the OP is shopping for the most money, or the best way to get into the field of interest. It's perfectly fair, because if someone is expecting the simple fact of what school they attended to do the grunt of the work at getting them hired, they're only doing themselves a disservice. The school you choose should be chosen for its ability to facilitate your existing interest in a particular field of study. If you cannot afford such a school, then pursue that interest seperately while you work on the fundamentals that the school can teach you.

At my place of employment, they exclusively shop MIT for IC design engineers. We've had a few real stinkers that didn't last, while some of our best designers either didn't come from those places, or worked their way into a design role from product engineering. We used to shop Berkley too, but once we found that the PhD's started using standard templates for thesis dissertations and were mostly walked through it by the profs, we've removed them from the priority list.

If I personally have the position to hire someone, I have no interest in your piece of paper. I'm going to flat out ask you, "show me what you have done." I want to see the kinds of problems that interest you, and I want to see how you've solved those problems. I want to see how you manage projects while dealing with your other daily obligations. All of these things are ultimately not something that is handed to you from a papermill. They are a function of your character. If I want a robot who simply repeats motions of existing, solved, problems I can pick up someone from over seas for a song; but I have no need for robots.

Ignoring the degree for a minute.  How does a newly minted grad come to your attention as a potential hire?  An automated resume parsing system?  How does that motivated, qualified candidate get your attention to get called for an interview?  Particularly ones that may not have any industry networking contacts... 

Rather than arguing over the merits of the piece of paper, could those that are actively involved in the hiring of EEs give some guidelines on how to get to the interview?

[mtdoc]

[
My question is what are you after ?

the university that gets you the best paid job ?
the university that gives you the best education ?

Good point but they may not be mutually exclusive.

My advice to the OP: If you can, go and spend a day or more at each campus sitting in on some EE classes, including labs. Talk to current EE students to get a feel for what they like and dislike about their program.

And as far as living expenses in Berkely vs Davis,  I can say from first hand experience that it is possible to live on the cheap in Berkeley (or nearby). It does take some determination and creativity - but those are good life skills to learn. Don't just max out student loans so you can live the easy life while a student. You'll learn less and regret the extra debt later on.