DuraHELL batteries

[madires]

If Duracells leak, file a claim.  I had a flashlight where Duracells had eaten up the inside of the aluminium. It cost me peanuts, but I claimed for the RRP, and they paid up no issues - close to £100. They don't want the bad press especially with how high profile they are.

AFAIK, Duracell never offered a compensation program for damages caused by leaking batteries in Germany. We have a product liability act which might be applied in this case, but it could involve hiring a lawyer.

[eti]

If Duracells leak, file a claim.  I had a flashlight where Duracells had eaten up the inside of the aluminium. It cost me peanuts, but I claimed for the RRP, and they paid up no issues - close to £100. They don't want the bad press especially with how high profile they are.

AFAIK, Duracell never offered a compensation program for damages caused by leaking batteries in Germany. We have a product liability act which might be applied in this case, but it could involve hiring a lawyer.

They do in the UK, specifically England, where I live. You guys need to sort it out then, get them to compensate you.

[magic]

I have never heard of anything like that either.

But at this point, alkalines are practically dead.

[eti]

I have never heard of anything like that either.

But at this point, alkalines are practically dead.

Alkaline batteries are nowhere near “dead”. Nonsense.

[wasyoungonce]

Reading this thread again...remembered 2 old multimeters I have!  One is an old favourite years back.  This prompted me to check them   

Sure enough Durahell batteries leaking, got to it just in time.   The other 9V battery just fine.  They are still in date...FWIW.

[floobydust]

"U.S. District Judge F. Dennis Saylor IV stated that plaintiffs Lauren Carlson and Jamal Yusuf did not do enough to support their claims that Duracell batteries contain a leak defect. Judge Saylor further claimed that no reasonable consumer would take Duracell’s “guarantee for 10 years in storage” as a promise of perfection.
"In the motion to dismiss the Duracell leaky battery class action lawsuit, Judge Saylor states that all manufactured products are susceptible to failing because they are designed and manufactured by human beings, and human beings make mistakes. According to Saylor, a “guarantee” is simply a promise that the manufacturer will replace the product or refund the purchase price if the item does not work as expected.


Duracell paid $2.2M for the class-action suit on their Model 350L LED flashlights.
"Customers in the Duracell flashlight battery class action lawsuit argued that three models of Duracell LED flashlights’ batteries were defective because they drained in less than a month. Allegedly, this occurred even if the flashlight was turned off."

"The Duracell class action asserted that this problem should have been covered by Duracell’s warranty that covers unused batteries. Duracell argued that once the batteries were in the flashlight, they should not be considered unused and should not be covered under the warranty.
"Duracell fired back that “per plaintiff’s logic, a car battery is ‘in storage’ when the car is not running, and a battery phone is ‘in storage’ so long as a phone is placed in the ‘off’ position.” According to Duracell, the customers’ claims are “absurd.”
"Duracell states that the customers did not describe in specifics what the warranty for the flashlight was. Duracell asserts that the customers only noted that the flashlights were advertised as “free from defects” and claimed that the battery drain was a defect and because Duracell had not issued a recall, Duracell was in violation of warranty. "

[Cubdriver]

Further reinforcement of my decision not to ever buy Corrodacells ever again unless I have absolutely no other option.  I've seen plenty of them leak in storage, unused, well before their 'use by' date.

-Pat

Edit to add regarding the Judge's comment about perfection during ten year storage, no, I realistically don't expect perfection.  But I also don't expect 20-30% of the cells to start puking their guts out less than half way through that 'guaranteed' storage period, either - I'd consider that to be a rather abysmal performance, integrity-wise.  I wonder what that judge would consider an unacceptable failure rate?

[wasyoungonce]

.............Duracell paid $2.2M for the class-action suit on their Model 350L LED flashlights. "Customers in the Duracell flashlight battery class action lawsuit argued that three models of Duracell LED flashlights’ batteries were defective because they drained in less than a month. Allegedly, this occurred even if the flashlight was turned off."

We used Duracell back in 1990s AAs as they were the only batteries accepted (by our Airforce and Army) to be used in Acft NVGs (fit for flight, no idea if they were classed MIL SPEC).     I was in charge of a maintenance facility for these NVGs.   

The batteries never leaked, that I know of!  Never.  They were the old Crimped cases.  We had hundreds of them in our stock and went thru them quickly.   We had to fit new batteries before every use and remove post use, throw them away (ahhh hummm throw them home) even if not used.

We used the same in our inspection torches they were fitted till they died.   But I never saw one leak ever, back then.

Funny thing around 1999 we got new Duracell AA batteries and they had changed a little.  They were wider than the old "crimped" versions and we had trouble fitting them.  I wonder if this was the introduction of the "glued cases?  We did not know at that stage what had happened and were trying to contact Duracell to find out "what's changed"...I never found out.

[SilverSolder]

"U.S. District Judge F. Dennis Saylor IV stated that plaintiffs Lauren Carlson and Jamal Yusuf did not do enough to support their claims that Duracell batteries contain a leak defect. Judge Saylor further claimed that no reasonable consumer would take Duracell’s “guarantee for 10 years in storage” as a promise of perfection.
[...]

Even in this forum full of engineers, we are having trouble coming up with concrete evidence or some kind of test that can prove beyond reasonable doubt that the Duraleaks are not very good compared to other batteries...

We do have a lot of anecdotal evidence, though.   Certainly enough to convince any reasonable person to be careful about using them in valuable equipment for extended time periods!

[rsjsouza]

Indeed. Floobydust's post is a cautionary tale for anyone trying to take to court a corporation without a mountain amount of really solid and indisputable evidence, have an army of good lawyers and be lucky to get a judge that is sympathetic towards your cause. Too bad that we small customers are left hanging with our precious deceased gizmos.

[SilverSolder]

Indeed. Floobydust's post is a cautionary tale for anyone trying to take to court a corporation without a mountain amount of really solid and indisputable evidence, have an army of good lawyers and be lucky to get a judge that is sympathetic towards your cause. Too bad that we small customers are left hanging with our precious deceased gizmos.

If it is a jury trial, you need to convince the jurors...  - it isn't really up to the judge, in theory at least...

Thinking about it, what might have worked is to bring in a mountain of leaky cells with recent date codes, as well as crying children with corroded toys, elderly ladies with corroded transistor radios that were mementos from deceased husbands,  engineers with corroded equipment and tools that they had become deeply familiar with over years, etc. - in other words, show the human cost of the selfish, inconsiderate, and morally reprehensible acts of the cheapskates at Duraleak Corporation! 

[helius]

If it is a jury trial, you need to convince the jurors...  - it isn't really up to the judge, in theory at least...

The judge is the one who decides what evidence the jury is allowed to hear. You might think that they simply follow objective rules of evidence in making that decision, but looking at transcripts of real cases will soon convince you otherwise.

[Fungus]

We used Duracell back in 1990s AAs as they were the only batteries accepted (by our Airforce and Army) to be used in Acft NVGs (fit for flight, no idea if they were classed MIL SPEC).     I was in charge of a maintenance facility for these NVGs.   

The batteries never leaked, that I know of!  Never. 

Back then they were allowed to use (eg.) cadmium in them to make them less likely to leak.

Things have changed now, Cadmium is banned because it's incredibly toxic.

We know this for a fact.

A couple of months ago I finally bit the bullet and went through all my stuff removing the alkalines. Anybody who's read this thread should do the same. If not, they only have themselves to blame for any future leaks in their stuff.

Bottom line: Don't use alkalines in anything valuable and/or anything that goes for months/years without a battery change. Use lithium or Eneloops instead.

Leave the alkalines for things which eat up batteries and need regular changes, that's where you'll save money by buying them.

[Fungus]

While I'm here I'm going to plug a web page... 

EEVBLOG's resident multimeter reviewer has also done very detailed tests on batteries and chargers:

https://lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers%20UK.html

https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/CommonAAcomparator.php

[Red Squirrel]

My turn to become victim.

My TV remote has been violated by Durahell.  TV would not turn on so I looked inside and sure enough.  Interestingly enough the battery still reads 1.4v but I did not try under any load.

Yum.



Money shot:




I do wonder if temperature cycling plays a role in this.  It's been very cold here, -40 range, and my house is badly insulated so if I'm sleeping, or not home, I just let the temp drop instead of having the furnace running non stop full pin just trying to maintain temp.   This creates a very large temp cycling of the house though as it will go as low as like 10c and then 20c when I do run the heat again. 

We also had a warm day, so I cranked the humidity up since it's been super dry.  (if I crank it too high when it's cold the windows frost up).  So these rather large swings in temp/humidity in past few days may have played a role maybe?  Either way it was probably bound to happen but it may have triggered it.

Thankfully it did not really damage the remote though, was able to clean it and it is good to go.   None of this seems to have leaked in the pcb.  Probably helps that with remote set on table as normal the batteries are the lowest part.

[Cubdriver]

My turn to become victim.

My TV remote has been violated by Durahell.  TV would not turn on so I looked inside and sure enough.  Interestingly enough the battery still reads 1.4v but I did not try under any load.

Yum.



Money shot:




I do wonder if temperature cycling plays a role in this.  It's been very cold here, -40 range, and my house is badly insulated so if I'm sleeping, or not home, I just let the temp drop instead of having the furnace running non stop full pin just trying to maintain temp.   This creates a very large temp cycling of the house though as it will go as low as like 10c and then 20c when I do run the heat again. 

We also had a warm day, so I cranked the humidity up since it's been super dry.  (if I crank it too high when it's cold the windows frost up).  So these rather large swings in temp/humidity in past few days may have played a role maybe?  Either way it was probably bound to happen but it may have triggered it.

Thankfully it did not really damage the remote though, was able to clean it and it is good to go.   None of this seems to have leaked in the pcb.  Probably helps that with remote set on table as normal the batteries are the lowest part.

I don't think the temp/humidity swings had anything to do with it, and that looks like way more than a few days worth of crustiness growth.  As I've stated before, I've had the damned things leak in their packaging while stored in my office, and I keep the temp pretty steady here.  I think it's just the normal Corrodacell 'quality' we've seen over the most recent 10-15 years.  Do they have a 'best by' date on them, and if so, what is it?

-Pat

[MrMobodies]

When I see a normal Duracell round cell I now just throw them out due to the damage and inconvenience they caused me in the past.

Joke: I think that one's "best by date" was last Christmas for the snow.

I use to buy used unopened EX110/MK100 Logitech keyboards on ebay and they had aa's and aaa's but what I found interesting that not all of them leaked despite being plastic wrapped together.

[Red Squirrel]

My turn to become victim.

My TV remote has been violated by Durahell.  TV would not turn on so I looked inside and sure enough.  Interestingly enough the battery still reads 1.4v but I did not try under any load.

Yum.



Money shot:




I do wonder if temperature cycling plays a role in this.  It's been very cold here, -40 range, and my house is badly insulated so if I'm sleeping, or not home, I just let the temp drop instead of having the furnace running non stop full pin just trying to maintain temp.   This creates a very large temp cycling of the house though as it will go as low as like 10c and then 20c when I do run the heat again. 

We also had a warm day, so I cranked the humidity up since it's been super dry.  (if I crank it too high when it's cold the windows frost up).  So these rather large swings in temp/humidity in past few days may have played a role maybe?  Either way it was probably bound to happen but it may have triggered it.

Thankfully it did not really damage the remote though, was able to clean it and it is good to go.   None of this seems to have leaked in the pcb.  Probably helps that with remote set on table as normal the batteries are the lowest part.

I don't think the temp/humidity swings had anything to do with it, and that looks like way more than a few days worth of crustiness growth.  As I've stated before, I've had the damned things leak in their packaging while stored in my office, and I keep the temp pretty steady here.  I think it's just the normal Corrodacell 'quality' we've seen over the most recent 10-15 years.  Do they have a 'best by' date on them, and if so, what is it?

-Pat

Yeah it's hard to tell how long it's been.   I'd have to get into the habit of checking more often.  Would be an interesting experiment to see if the process can be accelerated via temp swings though, like have a chamber, perhaps outside, that heats up to like 25C, and then lets the temp drop down to like 10 or something, then just keep cycling that.   Would need to take batteries from the same package, put some in the chamber, some just sitting in the house, and maybe some in the fridge, just to see if either one starts to leak faster.

[Fungus]

Yeah it's hard to tell how long it's been.   I'd have to get into the habit of checking more often.  Would be an interesting experiment to see if the process can be accelerated via temp swings though, like have a chamber, perhaps outside, that heats up to like 25C, and then lets the temp drop down to like 10 or something, then just keep cycling that.   Would need to take batteries from the same package, put some in the chamber, some just sitting in the house, and maybe some in the fridge, just to see if either one starts to leak faster.

I'm sure that's been tried many times but let us know the results.

I wonder about changes in atmospheric pressure, too.

Bottom line though: They never seem to leak when you try to get them to do it on purpose. Ask Dave. 

[Red Squirrel]

Bottom line though: They never seem to leak when you try to get them to do it on purpose. Ask Dave. 

Lol yeah that is funny.  It's definitely a mystery what actually causes it. 

[Neomys Sapiens]

Found in my Fluke12:
This explains the suspicious 'POP' which I heard some time ago. Luckily, the gooey stuff stayed inside.

[scopeman]

I do not know of any Alkalines that do not leak. I have a bagfull of Kirkland brand batteries that have several years to go on their storage life that are leaking. I am taking them back this week. It seems that they must have changed vendors as I have some that are years older that have not leaked. These are brand new cells that were just sitting in a rack.

If I have a piece of critical equipment I have started using the Energizer Ultimate Lithium's as I have never seen one leak. Also I use carbon zinc cells (the cheap ones from Dollar Tree) and have not had an issue with them. I have an Eveready D cell with a date code of 1948 on it that has never leaked. It is a standard LeClanche cell.

So I do not for the life of me know why they can't make cells that do not leak.

Sam'
W3OHM

[Fungus]

So I do not for the life of me know why they can't make cells that do not leak.

They can, but it would cost them pennies more.

There's no point in moaning about it though. We know the facts and we have Eneloops.

(and these days everybody and his dog is making NiMH with low self-discharge)

[Refrigerator]

Do you guys not buy the cheapest alkalines available?

I've been using GP alkaline batteries for years and never had a leak, but I'm interested to know if others have had any issues with them.

I had "GP Super" alkalines in my TI-82 for a few years until they ran out and they never leaked. Actually, after i changed them out i forgot to throw them away and i still have them.
And the dead batteries are still not leaking after sitting for another half a year.
Now i'm rocking some cheapo "Westrom" brand (generic brand basically) alkaline cells and they seem to be holding up just as well so far.

I've had one no-name AAA cell leak on me, but i did not buy that cell, rather i came with my cheap automatic welding mask and it lived through some tough conditions ranging from -15^oC to +30^oC.
Also that cell did not piss like a duracell, rather it was a slow leak. So slow, in fact, that i ignored it for a couple months and continued using the mask. 
Eventually i changed it out, of course. 

But really, what's the point of buying expensive cells these days?
More expensive = more better?
Well Duracells aren't.
Name brand = better?
Not Duracell.
Guaranteed to not leak?
Well you get the idea...

But what's to tell that other [insert brand] selling their [insert battery], and promising [insert claims] is not the same as Duracell?
So i buy the cheapest stuff (that doesn't look straight up dodgy of course), because they make no claims other than "this is a battery, it does battery things". 

[rdl]

Name brand anything costs more because of advertising, not because they're better. Because of penny pinching, greedy company executives they may actually be worse than no name products.