Against factory farming

[BravoV]

Mech, if I'm not mistaken, those are the law of Sharia when slaughtering an animal for consumption isn't it ?

Again, I'm not sure, is it forbidden to consume them if they were not done using those methods ?


PS : Sharia or Syariah = Islamic law & regulation

[slateraptor]

3) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood transporting waste incl urea (read to the end), you drink/consume blood, you drink your own (or animal) urine.
4) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decapitation goto Painlessness section. do you wonder why surgery knife is so sharp, try to cut your hand with one then you'll know why its painless.
swallow your ignorance and try to gather more facts. dont learn ee too much my friend

Evidently, the pics I've posted above weren't enough to clue you in to the fact that when it comes to slaughtering animals, I've done a bit more than merely talk the talk. So allow me to point out your ignorance, since it's quite obvious that you've cited the end-all-say-all Wikipedia without even a hint of what you're talking about:

Concerning contamination:
1) If you consume a tainted animal, "contaminated blood" is the absolute least of your worries. Evidently, you've never heard of concepts like cooking, red meat, or the abundance of capillaries in all mammalian species.

2) There's a popular Filipino dish called pinapaitan (pronounced pee-nah'-pah-ee'-tan) which uses COW PISS as a necessary broth ingredient. I'm certain there are other Southeast Asian countries that use animal piss in some form or fashion in their local dishes. Grow a pair and try it.

3) A Chamorro (my ethnic background) favorite is a dish called fritada (pronounced frih-taw'-dah), which is a stew made from pig blood; Filipinos call the same dish dinuguan, and the Spanish have a similar dish too although I don't know what they call it.

4) Surely, someone from Malaysia has heard of cobra's blood...or has your vegetarian diet made you too soft to dabble in local tradition?


Concerning torture minimization:
Your comment of slitting an animal's throat to achieve a swift death is about as ignorant as breaking toes to run faster.

1) Ever heard the old saying, "running around like a headless chicken"? Well, guess where it comes from? Slit a chicken's throat and see what happens; make sure you bring a few towels and have about 10-15 minutes to spare. There's a reason why we kill chickens by snapping its neck.

2) Slit a pig's throat and see what happens. Again, you'll need a few towels, 10-15 minutes, and a handful of fit grown men to hold it down because that hog is going to struggle like it's never struggled before. If you want to collect its blood, a sharpened 8 inch blade into the throat targeting its major artery is the swiftest bleed out and yields less than 5 minutes of struggle. If you've punctured its throat and the pig starts coughing out blood during its struggle, you've done fucked up. If you don't care about collecting blood, a small caliber bullet (.22 magnum typically) in the head is the quickest.

3) Slit a cow's throat and you'll probably end up in a hospital. Slit a bull's throat and you'll probably end up dead.

4) A large caliber bullet or arrow through the heart is the best way to kill deer, which minimizes adrenaline from affecting the meat, leaves a solid blood trail to track as it flees, and makes for a quick death.

So, what exactly was I swallowing again?? It might come to you as a surprise that some of us on this forum have diverse backgrounds that extend far beyond the typical electronics subject matter. For the record, EE and hunting aren't my only interests; I also dabble in firearms, high-security locks (in particular, Medeco, Mul-T-Lock and Abloy), and autocross.

[Wartex]

The fastest and least painful death is severe brain damage via hydraulic shock, such as a bullet or large rivet from a gun into the upper part of the brain. People who state arrow to the heart or cutting throats are idiots. Go look up human throat slittings on liveleak.com, see how "painless" it is.

People who complain about animals being killed for food are fucking pussies. Do you think when lions hunt zebras and rip them apart slowly so they can survive in the wild think about most humane way to kill the prey? We are predators, we kill to eat. We try to make it less painful for the animal, but if you need blood for cooking, the animal has to be killed slower. Have any of you fagitarians seen a human shot in the abdomen with a .50 cal round during a firefight? We do this for resources, not for immediate survival, and you are complaining about animals. Do you know why fuel is so cheap in USA? Because you shred humans worldwide with automatic high caliber ammo so you can take over oil deposits in their countries. And you are bitching about industrial farming.

Another issue: in industrial farming if there is a decease breakout, losses can be recovered within months. If you have a farm and all of your livestock dies you are fucked. You have nothing to sell and nothing to eat.

[slateraptor]

People who state arrow to the heart ... are idiots.

Just in case you missed my remark:

4) A large caliber bullet or arrow through the heart is the best way to kill deer, which minimizes adrenaline from affecting the meat, leaves a solid blood trail to track as it flees, and makes for a quick death.

...as if venison weren't gamey enough. First of all, fat chance you're getting into point-blank range of any wild deer, let alone drop it in one shot without a chase. Secondly, bullet in the head of a deer does 2 things: 1) fucks up your meat, and 2) fucks up your trophy.

[Psi]

People who complain about animals being killed for food are fucking pussies. Do you think when lions hunt zebras and rip them apart slowly so they can survive in the wild think about the most humane way to kill the prey?

There is a very important distinction between humans and animals.
We're intelligent enough to know it's wrong to cause suffering, animals aren't.

We can't justify suffering by pointing to animals inflicting it and saying "see, it's totally acceptable"

[slateraptor]

We're intelligent enough to know it's wrong to cause suffering, animals aren't.

The question of "wrong" is moot and belongs in the philosophical domain.

Besides pointing out valid (albeit tangential) observations, it's just Wartex raging...as usual.

[Wartex]

People who state arrow to the heart ... are idiots.

Just in case you missed my remark:

4) A large caliber bullet or arrow through the heart is the best way to kill deer, which minimizes adrenaline from affecting the meat, leaves a solid blood trail to track as it flees, and makes for a quick death.

...as if venison weren't gamey enough. First of all, fat chance you're getting into point-blank range of any wild deer, let alone drop it in one shot without a chase. Secondly, bullet in the head of a deer does 2 things: 1) fucks up your meat, and 2) fucks up your trophy.

Just in case you didn't get my comment: I was talking about slow vs fast death. I also said that if you want to preserve meat/blood/etc you need to kill slower, like slitting a throat or heart injury like you said with an arrow. I wasn't countering your argument.

[Mechatrommer]

there's more painless execution, ie shooting in the brain, right where the conciousness processing is. but the blood (waste) will stuck in the body. so slitting the throat is 2 in 1 action, the cleanest possible death while allowing "most" of the blood/waste to drain.

at BravoV, yes its syariah teaching, its forbidden to eat dead meat without the procedure (including some spiritual reading and praise to God, thats spiritual i cannot comment and will be pointless to discuss in this tangible world ) we just call it "dead animal", not food. there's exception in hard to catch animal, ie eg hunting using gun, but if possible, quickly get to the shoot animal and do the procedure.

at slateraptor, you've concluded the absolution of your understanding, for me i will say i dont know enough, esp on spiritual and psychological aspect. sure drinking your piss will not make you dead immediately or soon, just like smoking cigarette (in fact it feel good the cigarette, not piss!)

Slit a pig's throat and see what happens

thats why we are not allowed to eat pig, because it doesnt have a throat . not to mention the high uric/lactic acid in the bloodstream/meat and incomplete digestion system. and again dont tell me you'll live happily and healthier by eating pig, i cannot argue, i'm happy you can.

Slit a cow's throat and you'll probably end up in a hospital

thats me in green in the 1st picture (not that charming i know ), and thats my bro-in-law in white hat doing the procedure because i'm not good enough doing it. thats the sharp knife/sword (we call it parang) and thats the real cow behind the crowd/local. its the old school way of killing animal for food, no machinery no factory farm. nobody going to hospital after that, except "full".

i used my hard earn money to buy the cow, $700++ your currency today value, its recommended (not compulsary, only if you can afford) in my religion to do the "qurban/aqiqah" or sacrifice if we have newborn baby or in Hajj season. 1 boy = 2 goat, 1 girl = 1 goat, 1 cow = 7 goat, thats the equivalent of the sacrifice just to let you know the detail (if you interested), the meat will be distributed to the crowd, family, friend etc. we only consume a portion for a ceremony. the social aspect of this is we people get together from close to far distance, better bonding in the society, but... everybody can argue about anything

and is that have similarity to your "agrarian hardshipness" you mentioned before?

living off the land isn't a purely academic concept in my book, and the hardships of an agrarian life are all too familiar

[G7PSK]

People who state arrow to the heart ... are idiots.

Just in case you missed my remark:

4) A large caliber bullet or arrow through the heart is the best way to kill deer, which minimizes adrenaline from affecting the meat, leaves a solid blood trail to track as it flees, and makes for a quick death.

...as if venison weren't gamey enough. First of all, fat chance you're getting into point-blank range of any wild deer, let alone drop it in one shot without a chase. Secondly, bullet in the head of a deer does 2 things: 1) fucks up your meat, and 2) fucks up your trophy.

Just in case you didn't get my comment: I was talking about slow vs fast death. I also said that if you want to preserve meat/blood/etc you need to kill slower, like slitting a throat or heart injury like you said with an arrow. I wasn't countering your argument.

Actually there has been scientific tests done on how to kill to get the best flavor meat, the results showed that the least adrenalin in the system the better, therefore a shot that totally destroys the brain is best, The heart shot myth for deers is just for the sick people who like to kit out their caves with physical evidence  of their hunting prowess.
I have a friend who is a game keeper one of his jobs is to control deer numbers in the woods, I have been out with him shooting, What does he use for deer control, a .243 with ballistic tip for a head shot as he wants to sell the meat to a game dealer, The heads and horns go in the bin as he does not need hundreds of the things clogging up his house and the game dealer would not want the damage to the meat either mechanical or chemical from a heart lung shot.

[slateraptor]

so slitting the throat is 2 in 1 action, the cleanest possible death while allowing "most" of the blood/waste to drain.

I see that your comments are religiously motivated; I can turn a blind eye to that. However, with respect to "contaminated" blood, it doesn't matter if you've drain "most" of it. If the animal's blood is tainted, then its meat is tainted and shouldn't be eaten to begin with.

at slateraptor, you've concluded the absolution of your understanding, for me i will say i dont know enough, esp on spiritual and psychological aspect. sure drinking your piss will not make you dead immediately or soon, just like smoking cigarette (in fact it feel good the cigarette, not piss!)

Beef piss is the only kind I've ever seen/tried. I suspect this has much to do with the strict plant diet of cows, and boiling the broth likely denatures whatever harmful substances are in it. The dish uses only a small quantity to attain its distinct flavor, so it's not like you're whipping out your dick and going to town in your mouth.

and is that have similarity to your "agrarian hardshipness" you mentioned before?

Actually, it's not. Buying a cow for slaughter is nothing like raising a cow for slaughter. Similarly, buying vegetables at the market is nothing like planting and harvesting crop in the fields. That being said, I suspect local life in Malaysia is very similar to local life on my island, less the Islamic practices.

Your slaughter technique for cow is unusual, but I guess it's what your spiritual practices call for. I noticed that the cow was restrained with ropes and men; this is typically how we slaughter pig for fiesta back home, except we have a stone altar for the procedure (not anything religious, more of a custom from ancient days). We kill cow by moving it into a small pen to confine its movement then putting a bullet through its head; carcass is then manually strung up on an A-frame (like the deer in my photo) and butchered.

Actually there has been scientific tests done on how to kill to get the best flavor meat, the results showed that the least adrenalin in the system the better, therefore a shot that totally destroys the brain is best, The heart shot myth for deers is just for the sick people who like to kit out their caves with physical evidence  of their hunting prowess.

How about a citation. "Best flavor" is completely subjective and inherently unscientific to begin with. Besides, when I said, "fucks up your meat," I wasn't referring to flavor.