IPCC Boots Another One

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

Settle down Mr Poptones it is not the end of the world.

I agree with the main idea of Climate Change, which I think is that Mankind has an impact on the climate of the earth.  Therefore it is possible that the Climate systems of the earth could be brought closer to some sort of tipping point that has catastrophic results.

I don't actually need someone to prove this to be worried about it. Not necessarily for me but for future inhabitants of this planet.

What I would also like to say that when you borrow something, you should return it in the condition that it originally was.
With this in mind I would like to hand over the Earth to these future generations with its climatic systems in similar working order.

It's a fair point the probably the largest part of the recent warming is not due to humans, but how much we don't know.
So scientists keep researching. In the meantime don't pollute unnecessarily.

[r90s]

I have seen evidence that the computer algorithms were weighted to produce a result that agreed with the an agenda. This agenda promoted the argument that mankind was causing (what was then called) global warming.  Now I hear that there is a consensus.  This consensus only exists, I believe, to squelch any criticism of what some consider an agreeable result, for political and financial reasons.  I know that real science does not allow for a consensus, for "real science" is always open to new, and/or better evidence.

[EEVblog]

Which is another characteristic of  skeptics argument, ie. to distil a complex system down to a simplistic cause-effect relationship in order to support a preconceived notion.

Yep, classic straw man stuff, because that's all they have. They don't have the ability to actually analyse it any further nor do any original research. So they just build simple straw men and knock them down  %-B
What climate scientist wouldn't want to be the first to "disprove" many decades of intensive research to show that it's not anthropogenic?
Heck, even one of the worlds most reputable scientists, Richard Muller (who trained under Nobel winner Luis Alvarez no less), and partially funded by the climate sceptics recently did his own study and found that it's real. Because he was pissed off by the ClimateGate thing and wanted to see if there was any funny business. And this is a guy who likes to rock the boat and stick his neck out with "crazy" ideas that buck the trend.
That was probably the best shot possible to expose it, based on a re-examination of the data, yet he came away convinced.

Dave.

[poptones]

Talk about strawmen!

I haven't seen anyone in this thread say climate warming right now is not real.

I also haven't seen any believable proof it's not part of a completely natural cycle that has been recorded for over 400,000 years.

[Lightages]

Really, the Earth's climate is changing? Wow, this has never happened before! I can't believe it.

Hmmmm, what could be causing it......?

Aha! Human made carbon dioxide! It is much stranger and more powerful than any of the carbon dioxide that the Earth has ever produced on its own. Yeah, that must be it as we humans are all so powerful.

Wait a minute, this is crazy! It must be a conspiracy! All those big businesses that need to find another way to rape all of us poor mopes need another way to make us paranoid. They must have made up all of this to make use willing to pay whatever they deem necessary for oil and carbon credits so we can feel better about what we all have done to the planet.

Oh damn, there is war again. I guess then the scientists must have all lied because now we can see that their predictions didn't all come true. No need to worry about the climate now as those mad suicide bombers and crazy Muslims are the real worry. But wait! Maybe that is all a plot to keep oil prices higher too!

Damn I am so confused. I guess I will pray to God that he keeps the oil prices down and re-freezes all the polar ice. Oh damn, I must have prayed wrong because he is re-freezing the Antarctic ice and he is still melting the Arctic.

Oh well, science is BS, and I am a sinner, so I guess it really doesn't matter what I do. My Hummer H3 needs another 100 litres to get to the grocery store, so fill'rup! Yes I would like all my groceries double bagged in those nice plastic bags please. I can never have enough plastic to throw out. Can you give me a discount on the plastic garbage bags I just purchased to put all my garbage plastic bags in please?

Oh yes, what was I worried about? Global warming? Terrorists? Muslims? Gas prices? Oops sorry, yes double size my fries and cola please, I am still hungry after my 2 double size whoppers. I really wish they would put more streetlights up, I can't see if I dropped my Snickers bar on the floor of this damn H3.

[perfect_disturbance]

What is it about this thread that reminds me of the stupids thread?

[EEVblog]

Oh yes, what was I worried about? Global warming? Terrorists? Muslims? Gas prices? Oops sorry, yes double size my fries and cola please, I am still hungry after my 2 double size whoppers. I really wish they would put more streetlights up, I can't see if I dropped my Snickers bar on the floor of this damn H3.

Why does that remind me of this?!


Dave.

[aargee]

Ahh, stuff all this I'm going out to buy another, better, oscilloscope.

How hard it is for us to get off the merry-go-round. How hard it is that society can't take these steps to reduce our footprint on this fragile place. How hard it is to re-wire our brains, which, as it turns out, is not very hard at all.

I try not to feel guilty that technology and specifically, electronics is my life - but a nibbling, clawing little seed of doubt tells me this will change, whether I like it or not.

[tom66]

Regardless of anthropogenic climate change, which is a real phenomenon, we should take care of this planet for our future generations.

Investing in renewable energies is a good idea because it means we can wean ourself off oil which causes a lot of pollution not just across the globe but in cities as well.  It also gives us a more stable supply of energy.

[ciccio]

To day I had the time for a careful reading of this topic.
My personal opinion is that we should divide the problem in two parts:
pollution and climatic change.
Anybody with a not-sick mind will agree that we must stop polluting our planet.
There are many decision that could be taken and many actions that could be forced to help doing this.
On th other side, many people, including me, cannot agree with the assumption that the climate change (towards a global warming) is due to human activities.
The sun's power is so much higher than the total power used by mankind that our contribution is ridiculous.
Green energy sources can increase pollution when the sources are manufactured (nobody cares, for example, that, for building windmills in Europe, Chinese are polluting an entire province where the rare hearths used for the magnets are extracted ).
I'm obliged to install CFL lamps that pollute with their manufacturing process, don't last for the claimed useful life and pollute when discarded.
I stop here, but the list could be longer...
Sometimes I'm forced to believe that many "green" political decision (such as increasing my electrical bill to finance alternative energy sources, that are not economically feasible by themselves, is only a way to move my money from my pockets to the pockets of some corporation.
Best regards.

[ivan747]

We are going to have a carbon tax starting next year. Yet they won't measure your actual emissions and take the manufacturer's specification instead.

 And don't even get me started on how some groups will have the tax exempted.

[G7PSK]

There is one thing about the global warming debate that no one from either side can refute. The tax man is having a field day.

[poptones]

What China does in China is not my problem. The people need more rights, well so do we. They pollute their water and their earth well so do we, we just have taxpayers pay to clean it up and they have poor people clean it up. Wait, how the hell do they even pay for stuff if there's no taxpayers? Surely the tiny middle class is not supporting that government, they must make their money another way - of yeah, that's right the government owns the tools of production. So the government is ruining the land and oppressing the people - not my problem. Did you know Bratz dolls smell wonderful? They do, you open the box and the smell is fantastic, and that smell stays with the doll forever, like that weird sweet smell you get on your fingers when you pick up a dog's slimy squeakie toy. You know why Bratz dolls smell so great? Because every Bratz doll is blessed with the tears of an oppressed chinese dissident.

Ahhh, oppression...

[ftransform]

Don't worry we will use high altitude nuclear weapons to clean up the CO2 in the sky and follow up by imposing sanctions.

[SgtRock]

Greetings EEVBees:

--Thanks everyone for the mostly reasonable comments. Profanity and cursing, betray hostility, and are the mark of a troll, in my opinion. In this very thread, I tended to agree with some of what was said by the person using the foul language, and I thought it detracted from the argument.

To Tom66: please note the the HadCRUT graph I used is the same graph that is used in your first posted link. Even Phil Jones admits that there has been no statistically significant warming since 1995. Not that that proves anything necessarily, but it does confirm the HadCRUT graph.

--I think that IPCC should be put in the same class as Wikipedia, I.E., if it makes a non controversial claim, or a claim that can be backed up by two other sources, then it can safely be believed. IPCC has made entirely too many wild, ridiculous claims for any further claims not to be looked at askance.

--Now, both Dave and Tom66 have made the assertion that a Carbon Taxes are a good thing to do, whether or not AGW is proven or not. A very valid point of view (though I disagree), I admit, but I am still interested in whether these Taxes are actually going to decrease temperatures or not, just as a matter of intellectual curiosity, if nothing else.

"Wish in on hand and whiz in the other, and see which one fills up first."
Gator Dundee 1948 -

Best Regards
Clear Ether