EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)

[Cerebus]

I don't understand why a company buys such an award, if everyone can read this on Wikipedia and other sites.

Simple: Batteroo's target market is not fact-checkers.

Amazingly HP Enterprise, Agilent and Keysight have all bought at least one Frost and Sullivan award.

[samgab]

New for 2017, I'm announcing my new "Samgab Awards"!! For a very reasonable fee starting from only $100,000 and up, your product or service can receive the prestigious Samgab Award, complete with inkjet printed award documentation created in Microsoft Publisher! Contact me for further details!

I think this new business is going to be a winner!

[StillTrying]

 
2015 North American Alkaline Battery Price/Performance Value Leadership Award 
http://ww2.frost.com/index.php/download_file/10969
 

[EEVblog]

2015 North American Alkaline Battery Price/Performance Value Leadership Award
http://ww2.frost.com/index.php/download_file/10969
 

Customer Ownership Experience
Batteroo welcomes customer feedback about the Batteriser, either through its Web site or
via email or social media platforms (including Facebook and Twitter). Its crowd funding
campaign established an active dialogue between its team and the early adopters of the
product. When the product is commercialized, Batteroo plans to enhance its customer
relationship management tools.

 

[ez24]

2015 North American Alkaline Battery Price/Performance Value Leadership Award
http://ww2.frost.com/index.php/download_file/10969
 

With these awards and successful videos, I am sure 99% of the population will think these are good.  I am also sure that 99% people here will think they are bad.

[StillTrying]

New for 2017, I'm announcing my new "Samgab Awards"!!

You'll need to have a lot more words in there to make it more prestigious, "Value", "Leadership", even just random stuff would do, how about "Alkaline Battery Price" as a filler.

[Domagoj T]

Price/Performance

The higher the number the better, right? Right?
Right?

Hmmm, my calculator complains when I try to divide by 0. I guess it's at its limits of comprehending the value of the Batterizer.

[ruffy91]

Price/Performance

The higher the number the better, right? Right?
Right?

Hmmm, my calculator complains when I try to divide by 0. I guess it's at its limits of comprehending the value of the Batterizer.

Batteroo lowers performance by 87.5% so the ratio price/performance is increased by 800%!

[FrankBuss]

Did any other (independent) person than Dave, EcProjects or me post a video of how the Batteroo sleeve performs, besides the few unboxing videos? Looks strange if they really shipped it to all 7393 backers. Even if only 1% are interested in testing and documenting it with a video, we should have dozens by now, and even more with the $500 contest they are running (page not found now for https://www.batteroo.com/contest ).

[ez24]

even more with the $500 contest they are running[/s] (page not found now for https://www.batteroo.com/contest ).

I think they took that page down because they won it with their camera video.

[dr_frost_dk]

They finally deleted the comment on indiegogo with the link to dave's video , think it stod for over 3 days

[StillTrying]

Did any other (independent) person than Dave, EcProjects or me post a video of how the Batteroo sleeve performs

I don't know of any more 'not known' videos. There this French test of course where he puts the 'AA' sleeves on 4 'used batteries' and gets over 100 flashes, not very scientific, but sounds reasonable.
http://www.geeknewz.fr/review-batteroo-faites-revivre-vos-piles-facon-zombie-27323

Looks strange if they really shipped it to all 7393 backers. Even if only 1% are interested in testing and documenting it with a video, we should have dozens by now

I agree, in this active-participation type of thing I'd expect it to be well over 1%, even if you go just by the number of comments/twitters - it doesn't add up.

even more with the $500 contest they are running (page not found now

Yep, their contest page says /said: submit the URL link with your image, or video for a chance to win our $500 pre-paid gift cards. We pick a winner EVERY MONTH!

Perhaps there'll be a new contest next month. 

[romelec]

There this French test of course where he puts the 'AA' sleeves on 4 'used batteries' and gets over 100 flashes, not very scientific, but sounds reasonable.
http://www.geeknewz.fr/review-batteroo-faites-revivre-vos-piles-facon-zombie-27323

He considered that the batteries were "used" just because the battery gauge was low...
He got 100 flashes but sometimes it didn't work and had to wait/restart the flash multiple times.

And who uses alkaline on a 500€ flash ?

[FrankBuss]

There this French test of course where he puts the 'AA' sleeves on 4 'used batteries' and gets over 100 flashes, not very scientific, but sounds reasonable.
http://www.geeknewz.fr/review-batteroo-faites-revivre-vos-piles-facon-zombie-27323

He considered that the batteries were "used" just because the battery gauge was low...
He got 100 flashes but sometimes it didn't work and had to wait/restart the flash multiple times.

He didn't use the dead batteries, which recovered for some days, without the sleeve, which would have worked, too, even if the battery gauge was low. I guess sometimes it didn't work because the output voltage dropped suddenly if there were some current spikes, because of the dead batteries (we know that Batteroo doesn't regulate always to 1.5 V, but it depends on the input voltage as well). This page says normal battery life with Alkaline is 110 shots for this flash, so overall this sounds like a good application for the Batteroo sleeve. But without the sleeve it would have probably lasted for the same time, based on the experience with the MP3 players. Of course, I wouldn't like it if it sometimes works and sometimes not. Best result in price per shot would be to use rechargeable batteries, which he has, too.

[Pilleville]

There this French test of course where he puts the 'AA' sleeves on 4 'used batteries' and gets over 100 flashes, not very scientific, but sounds reasonable.
http://www.geeknewz.fr/review-batteroo-faites-revivre-vos-piles-facon-zombie-27323

He considered that the batteries were "used" just because the battery gauge was low...
He got 100 flashes but sometimes it didn't work and had to wait/restart the flash multiple times.

And who uses alkaline on a 500€ flash ?

That's the problem. The Batteroo has a great placebo potential. The costumer notices that the gauge is low, puts on the sleeve, it's full again and the thing works abit more. Or, if the sleeve is on from the beginning, that the "charge is full" really long compared to as usual before dropping really fast. Most ordinary costumers don't know that the battery gauge doesn't measure capacity left but potential, apart from some fancy equipment that measures current and are using a fixed rechargeable battery.

I don't understand why a company buys such an award, if everyone can read this on Wikipedia and other sites.

Simple: Batteroo's target market is not fact-checkers.

Why fact check cheap consumer products in the couple off dollars range? I just buy and test. People might believe for example that the Batteroo is a battery conditioner/cell balancer or something. I mean I'm mostly interested about this drama becouse I'm a tech enthusiast.

Looks strange if they really shipped it to all 7393 backers. Even if only 1% are interested in testing and documenting it with a video, we should have dozens by now

I agree, in this active-participation type of thing I'd expect it to be well over 1%, even if you go just by the number of comments/twitters - it doesn't add up.

I think you overestimate the share of people that would post a review of this on youtube/blog/w/e by one or two orders of magnitude. But I've got no facts to back that up 

[dexters_lab]

8 of the AA sleeves arrived with me today, in fact they were delivered last week but i had to pick them up from the post office

open to suggestions as to what to do with them

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

[StuUK]

8 of the AA sleeves arrived with me today, in fact they were delivered last week but i had to pick them up from the post office

open to suggestions as to what to do with them

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

it would appear they can blow themselves up.....

[Fungus]

8 of the AA sleeves arrived with me today, in fact they were delivered last week but i had to pick them up from the post office

open to suggestions as to what to do with them

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

More hits for 'Batteriser' on google is good. Put them in something, time how long it lasts with/without. Post the results somewhere. Make video if possible.


(Or send a couple to me, I''ll do it..)

[SeanB]

Put 8 of them with an AA cell in series and see if it can start a car as the battery.

[ez24]

8 of the AA sleeves arrived with me today, in fact they were delivered last week but i had to pick them up from the post office

open to suggestions as to what to do with them

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

I would like to see the monkey test

[Hensingler]

I think you overestimate the share of people that would post a review of this on youtube/blog/w/e by one or two orders of magnitude. But I've got no facts to back that up 

I would have thought the selection of people finding and backing stuff on indiegogo would have way above average levels of social and new media involvement. That said a proportion may well want to keep quiet when they realise they paid money for a piece of crap.

As an aside I commended the syyenergy7 guy on youtube for discovering eneloops but now see he uses a Bedini Renaissance charger with them. $300 for a piece of crap battery charger from a free energy loon. He also uses 'zappers' strapped to his ankles to kill parasites in his bloodstream like:

According to Hulda Clark:
“Parasites can be killed with a very small voltage. But only IF the voltage is 100% Positive Offset, and only IF the voltage is varied up and down repeatedly”.
“If the varying voltage become NEGATIVE, even momentarily, it supports and maintains their lives!” ,,,, “If the voltage is applied in pulses, to produce a "Square wave, it will affect many parasites at once so that the rate raising and lowering it, called frequency, is not critical. Even though these tiny animals undoubtedly have a "mortal frequency", (NOTE: ADDITIONALLY USING THE MORTAL FREQUENCY SHOULD GIVE EVEN MORE SUCCESS) this rate does not need to be known or used when a square wave of electricity, totally positive, is used.” ,,,, “A positive electrical force that pulses up and down not only appears to kill tiny invaders, it also seems to energize white blood cells to go on an all-out attack on your enemies: your parasites, your toxins everything in spite of their four blockers. In spite of benzene PCBs, metals and asbestos! For a time your white blood cells turn into Super-WBCs. That is why I recommend eight hours of zapping daily until you are well.”

The guy is completely bat shit crazy - par for the course for Batteriseroo supporters I guess.

[razvanme]

8 of the AA sleeves arrived with me today, in fact they were delivered last week but i had to pick them up from the post office

open to suggestions as to what to do with them

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

I still think the batteroos have a meltdown when placed in series and a relatively high current is needed. Everyone is expecting a meltdown video. So two or three of them in series in a flashlight or any other product that requires a high current from time to time.

[Hensingler]

more testing? blow them up? give some away?

We have only seen performance plots on AAAs up to 120mA so far. AA performance at higher current and finding the maximum current would be interesting. Maybe just a quick look as Dave will be getting AAs and no point overlapping what he wants to do.

Don't think we have seen decent photos of the AA PCB yet.

[romelec]

As the French guy did, a test with a camera flash is a good idea because there should be large current bursts.

[Fungus]

I still think the batteroos have a meltdown when placed in series and a relatively high current is needed. Everyone is expecting a meltdown video. So two or three of them in series in a flashlight or any other product that requires a high current from time to time.

It wouldn't be hard to do it in a controlled way. Use a dummy load (or get a MOSFET and a potentiometer) and see what happens.

No testing has been done for temperature yet. How hot do they get under load?