EEVblog #1337 - I Bought An Electric Car

[EEVblog]

But why are you disingenuously presenting it as an either-or choice? I can swap my power tool batteries or charge them.

Power tool batteries don't weigh hundreds of kilograms, aren't the size of a refrigerator, and aren't a HV safety hazard.

[EEVblog]

Apparently people have never heard of fuel containers, pump trunks or gravity fed fuel tanks.

99.9% of the population is 100% reliant upon the electric petrol pump at their location petrol station.

[EEVblog]

There's really no need to get personal.

you made it personal

Besides, I'm not the one rejecting an idea because it requires changing my habits and expectations.

right because we should all change our habits to accommodate frivolous tech trends and consumer marketing.

[/quote]

No one is saying you should change anything, it's your choice.

[EEVblog]

EVs , combined with smart charging, actually benefit the grid, as they can help balance load.

Please explain. To me it seems that every day at 5pm there will be a gigantic spike in demand.

EV's have charge timers in them. You can set it to switch on any time you like. And also set it so that the timer changes depending upon your location, e.g. work and home.
This is on top of potential network controlled usage just like how off-peak hot water systems have worked for almost 70 years now to control peak loads on the grid.

[timelessbeing]

But why are you disingenuously presenting it as an either-or choice? I can swap my power tool batteries or charge them.

Power tool batteries don't weigh hundreds of kilograms, aren't the size of a refrigerator, and aren't a HV safety hazard.

Certainly there are different consideration but not insurmountable I think. There are forklifts batteries with more energy than a Nissan leaf. If we can make automated car washes and car parks, then we can make battery stations. The driver need never touch it . Gasoline can be dangerous too, yet someone how manage to use it daily.

Come now, Dave. Your car is barely bigger than a kitchen refrigerator. The battery is more a like a mini beer fridge.

[timelessbeing]

Apparently people have never heard of fuel containers, pump trunks or gravity fed fuel tanks.

99.9% of the population is 100% reliant upon the electric petrol pump at their location petrol station.

It's high, but that's an exaggeration. And it's only true MOST of the time, like commuting around the city. But you completely ignore rural areas, and remote commercial and industrial operations, or just venturing away from civilisation. The point is having options and flexibility. An battery only car is as good as tree stump outside of the electrical grid.

[timelessbeing]

EVs , combined with smart charging, actually benefit the grid, as they can help balance load.

Please explain. To me it seems that every day at 5pm there will be a gigantic spike in demand.

EV's have charge timers in them. You can set it to switch on any time you like. And also set it so that the timer changes depending upon your location, e.g. work and home.
This is on top of potential network controlled usage just like how off-peak hot water systems have worked for almost 70 years now to control peak loads on the grid.

I don't know about you, but if it was my only means of transportation, then I would want it charged ASAP. I don't need a dead car sitting in the driveway.

[timelessbeing]

From the proclamations I hear by Dave and others, I know that there's one main reason people buy electric cars: to tell other people that they bought an electric car.

I get it. It's an exciting and cool new toy. But these initial reactions are not interesting. Make a video in 10 years time (if you still have it), when you're not trying to justify your purchase, and then tell us why you're still glad you bought one.

Yes, there certainly are limited practical applications, but it's still mostly a novelty. We are still far away from widespread use. Especially by the commercial sector, and not just fanatical consumers.

[EEVblog]

Certainly there are different consideration but not insurmountable I think. There are forklifts batteries with more energy than a Nissan leaf. If we can make automated car washes and car parks, then we can make battery stations. The driver need never touch it . Gasoline can be dangerous too, yet someone how manage to use it daily.

Of course, and it's been tried, and the enthusiasm for it just isn't there.
https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2020/06/nio-has-completed-500000-ev-battery-swaps/
The thing is, people don't really like going to petrol stations, and it stands to reasons they won't like going to battery swap stations either.
When you own an EV you realise it's innately satisfying about coming home or going to work or going to the shopping centre or pub and plugging in your EV, instead of having to go somewhere specific just to charge it.

[SilverSolder]

For those that can't make up their minds, or want the best of both worlds:  Plug-in Hybrid!

You can't beat the flexibility of that, in my view.  That's what I'm going for with the next car replacement.

[EEVblog]

From the proclamations I hear by Dave and others, I know that there's one main reason people buy electric cars: to tell other people that they bought an electric car.

Wrong.

I get it. It's an exciting and cool new toy. But these initial reactions are not interesting. Make a video in 10 years time (if you still have it), when you're not trying to justify your purchase, and then tell us why you're still glad you bought one.

Go join an EV forum and you'll have your answer.
I've been on EV forums for years and know many EV owners, many have even built their own from scratch in the 2000's before all the hoopla.
I have never heard single one of them, even more than a decade later say they regret it or they wouldn't do it again. Not a single one.

Yes, there certainly are limited practical applications, but it's still mostly a novelty. We are still far away from widespread use. Especially by the commercial sector, and not just fanatical consumers.

You are becoming more demonstrably wrong every single year.

[SilverSolder]

Got a fuel pump at home?

Also, I don't see dependence on the electrical grid as a good thing.

No electrical grid? No pumps 50m from your house. Next daft argument?

It's not a super-daft point...  some parts of the world (even civilised parts) have power outages that can last up to 2 weeks, e.g. after a storm or a hurricane (which occur with boring regularity in some areas).
But, the risk of being immobilized due to grid failure can be mitigated with a generator, or perhaps a PHEV is a smarter solution in those areas where power is unreliable.

Pro Tip: Petrol pumps don't work without the power grid either.

Fair point - but many petrol stations around here have generators and remain open in the aftermath of a storm.  If there's one thing those guys have enough of, it is petrol to run a genny! 

[timelessbeing]

Certainly there are different consideration but not insurmountable I think. There are forklifts batteries with more energy than a Nissan leaf. If we can make automated car washes and car parks, then we can make battery stations. The driver need never touch it . Gasoline can be dangerous too, yet someone how manage to use it daily.

Of course, and it's been tried, and the enthusiasm for it just isn't there.
https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2020/06/nio-has-completed-500000-ev-battery-swaps/
The thing is, people don't really like going to petrol stations, and it stands to reasons they won't like going to battery swap stations either.
When you own an EV you realise it's innately satisfying about coming home or going to work or going to the shopping centre or pub and plugging in your EV, instead of having to go somewhere specific just to charge it.

That is completely understandable! And if I had one then I would charge it at home at every opportunity. I don't think people SHOULD have to go to a station. I just think the option should be there, because the alternative (getting stranded) is unacceptable.

[timelessbeing]

For those that can't make up their minds, or want the best of both worlds:  Plug-in Hybrid!

You can't beat the flexibility of that, in my view.  That's what I'm going for with the next car replacement.

It's a very attractive compromise. And I think it's why the worlds biggest and smartest auto maker is only selling hybrids. They're not going to gamble on a fad.

[SilverSolder]

[...]  We are still far away from widespread use. Especially by the commercial sector, and not just fanatical consumers.

Somebody has to be the pioneers...   back in the day when petrol cars began to replace horses and buggies, there were likely people saying that these newfangled, unreliable rich man's toys will never catch on! 

[timelessbeing]

A thought just occurred to me. What if your battery runs out in the middle of nowhere? There are always unimaginable situations, but lets say the nearest charging station has gone offline or something. Is the tow truck the only option?

[timelessbeing]

[...]  We are still far away from widespread use. Especially by the commercial sector, and not just fanatical consumers.

Somebody has to be the pioneers...   back in the day when petrol cars began to replace horses and buggies, there were likely people saying that these newfangled, unreliable rich man's toys will never catch on! 

Yes, and the pioneers were quite wealthy, and they still kept the horse and buggy parked in the stables.

[EEVblog]

That is completely understandable! And if I had one then I would charge it at home at every opportunity. I don't think people SHOULD have to go to a station. I just think the option should be there, because the alternative (getting stranded) is unacceptable.

Then just buy a hybrid! 

[timelessbeing]

many have even built their own from scratch

well that's true fanaticism.

You are becoming more demonstrably wrong every single year.

I would hope so!

I want it to succeed. I would love an electric vehicle and I believe that they have enormous potential. I just think that right now they are throwing us bones and hoping we bite.

[EEVblog]

A thought just occurred to me. What if your battery runs out in the middle of nowhere? There are always unimaginable situations, but lets say the nearest charging station has gone offline or something. Is the tow truck the only option?

Same risk as a petrol car, and same consequences. Let's say you are driving in a rural area and you were relying on the next town having a petrol station, only to find it out of petrol or broken down, you are just as screwed.
With both EV and ICE you can try and find someone local who has either charge or petrol. I'd wager it's maybe easier to find a local who will let you borrow their power point than it is to find a local who has spare petrol in cans or wants to siphon their tank using their garden hose.

[timelessbeing]

That is completely understandable! And if I had one then I would charge it at home at every opportunity. I don't think people SHOULD have to go to a station. I just think the option should be there, because the alternative (getting stranded) is unacceptable.

Then just buy a hybrid! 

I would consider it, but as I said, I'm disappointed with the offerings so far.

[EEVblog]

many have even built their own from scratch

well that's true fanaticism.

So are your posts here.

[EEVblog]

That is completely understandable! And if I had one then I would charge it at home at every opportunity. I don't think people SHOULD have to go to a station. I just think the option should be there, because the alternative (getting stranded) is unacceptable.

Then just buy a hybrid! 

I would consider it, but as I said, I'm disappointed with the offerings so far.

Then just wait and let all those other EV owner you're disparaging help drive the market forward instead of endlessly complaining about it 

[EEVblog]

Come now, Dave. Your car is barely bigger than a kitchen refrigerator. The battery is more a like a mini beer fridge.

Your ability to do volumetric guesstimating is embarrassing, don't give up your day job.

[Monkeh]

many have even built their own from scratch

well that's true fanaticism.

So are your posts here.

Careful Dave, he'll take it personally.

If building your own EV is fanatical, are we all electronic fanatics? Does that mean we shouldn't have opinions and our knowledge is corrupted?