Agilent DSOX2024 Won't Boot

[GlowingGhoul]

That's not Keysight's fault. They owe him nothing.

+1

If he gets this sorted for him for free it is just out of good will on Keysights side. And yet he keeps bashing them in every single post 

Imagine you just got a new replacement car under warranty, and it fails with less than 10 hours of use. Then you get back to the dealer and they give you a repair price higher than that of  a brand new car. Would you be happy? Would you fix your car? - Please put yourself in my situation and decide if you would be happy or not. Maybe this kind of situation would make you happy, and that's fine, but it doesn't work for me.

Imagine you just got a replacement TV under warranty. You let it sit for half a year beyond it's warranty expiration date and you really, honestly turn it on for the first time and it doesn't work. You think you're entitled to a free repair or replacement.

Imagine you just got a replacement TV under warranty. You use it every day until it's months passed the warranty expiration. Then it fails, and you didn't buy the extended warranty. You want a free repair so you tell the the story above.

The only reasonable thing a company can do is honor their warranty commitment, otherwise every expired warranty will be a "special case".

He's hired a lawyer now, Keysight would be wise to back off now as I have no doubt any assistance given by them will be used to bash them over the head as an "admission of guilt".

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

He's hired a lawyer now, Keysight would be wise to back off now as I have no doubt any assistance given by them will be used to bash them over the head as an "admission of guilt".

Haha, I'm not too worried.  The error he's seeing is definitely a special case.  If it hadn't had been in for service recently and was the as-shipped unit it would potentially be a different story.

[bsgd]

That's not Keysight's fault. They owe him nothing.

+1

If he gets this sorted for him for free it is just out of good will on Keysights side. And yet he keeps bashing them in every single post 

Imagine you just got a new replacement car under warranty, and it fails with less than 10 hours of use. Then you get back to the dealer and they give you a repair price higher than that of  a brand new car. Would you be happy? Would you fix your car? - Please put yourself in my situation and decide if you would be happy or not. Maybe this kind of situation would make you happy, and that's fine, but it doesn't work for me.

Imagine you just got a replacement TV under warranty. You let it sit for half a year beyond it's warranty expiration date and you really, honestly turn it on for the first time and it doesn't work. You think you're entitled to a free repair or replacement.

Imagine you just got a replacement TV under warranty. You use it every day until it's months passed the warranty expiration. Then it fails, and you didn't buy the extended warranty. You want a free repair so you tell the the story above.

The only reasonable thing a company can do is honor their warranty commitment, otherwise every expired warranty will be a "special case".

He's hired a lawyer now, Keysight would be wise to back off now as I have no doubt any assistance given by them will be used to bash them over the head as an "admission of guilt".

Haha, that's funny! I believe you are kidding right?  If it aint a joke, Im sure this is just another fake profile trying to throw some gasoline on the fire, which is also great for our discussion and to bring some more attention and different perspectives  This is an open forum and I completely respect your perspective, even though it is not the reality of what I have done.

Someone in this thread recommended me to go to Procon and I told I would go, just to know if a repair in my country in this case is legal or not. Turns out according to our laws, it is legal. I have not hired a lawyer because I dont need to, this is a free public service offered by our government to protect consumers. And do you really think I could hire a lawyer for 2.000 dollars? Thats quite naive or lawyers in yoyr country earn too little haha...it would be much cheaper to just throw away the scope and get a new one! Keysight has been very helfpul, I can only thank Daniel for being so kind and understanding. I truly believe Keysight US is doing a good job dealing with this situation. I have said this here and at another thread quite a few times since Daniel joined the discussion.   


Regarding the TV example, Im sorry to know your country does not have this kind of consumer protection, but I also didnt know that until someone joined in the discussion a few pages ago and directed me to the specific law (in portuguese)  we have here that guarantees a 90 days warranty after the defect is found, not matter how much time passed since the original warranty expired, as long as the defect is not obvious and takes some time to show up or a specific condition to appear. They call this 'Hidden Manufacturing Defect'.

Thank you for bringing your perspective to my thread and sharing with us

BTW, where do you live? I'd really like to know, since I know it's not in the US or EU, whcih carry a similar but much better consumer protection laws. Please share!

[bsgd]

He's hired a lawyer now, Keysight would be wise to back off now as I have no doubt any assistance given by them will be used to bash them over the head as an "admission of guilt".

Haha, I'm not too worried.  The error he's seeing is definitely a special case.  If it hadn't had been in for service recently and was the as-shipped unit it would potentially be a different story.

Daniel, could you please lend me some money? I believe 10.000 USD will suffice. I need to hire a lawyer to take care of some situation I'm having and since we have been 'friends' for a few days I tought maybe you could help me? 

Sorry, I just couldnt resist. People here are definitely funny.

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

Daniel, could you please lend me some money? I believe 10.000 USD will suffice. I need to hire a lawyer to take care of some situation I'm having and since we have been 'friends' for a few days I tought maybe you could help me? 

Sorry, I just couldnt resist. People here are definitely funny.

I've got $10

[wraper]

Regarding the TV example, Im sorry to know your country does not have this kind of consumer protection, but I also didnt know that until someone joined in the discussion a few pages ago and directed me to the specific law (in portuguese)  we have here that guarantees a 90 days warranty after the defect is found, not matter how much time passed since the original warranty expired, as long as the defect is not obvious and takes some time to show up or a specific condition to appear. They call this 'Hidden Manufacturing Defect'.

Does that mean you can ask for free repair after say 20 years? BTW, the defect your scope has is quiet obvious I may say and is no way hidden.

[bsgd]

Regarding the TV example, Im sorry to know your country does not have this kind of consumer protection, but I also didnt know that until someone joined in the discussion a few pages ago and directed me to the specific law (in portuguese)  we have here that guarantees a 90 days warranty after the defect is found, not matter how much time passed since the original warranty expired, as long as the defect is not obvious and takes some time to show up or a specific condition to appear. They call this 'Hidden Manufacturing Defect'.

Does that mean you can ask for free repair after say 20 years? BTW, the defect your scope has is quiet obvious I may say and is no way hidden.

No, the law does not specify, as the product must go thought a specific condition to exhibit the problem. They told they have seen cases with 2+ years, and even some safety problems involving cars (which were worse). Of course they would never accept a case where something went wrong after 20+ years, Im sure they are smart enough to analyze the situation and only take what is considered good faith or everyone would complain about everything.

Yes, they did consider it hidden because I had to leave the equipment on for hours before the problem appeared. And since this a backup unit its rarely used for hours without being turned off (its raely used at all actually). The first time the problem showed up the equipmentwas on for 2+ hours, but the problem got worse for some reason and last time I checked it only had to be left on for 40 minutes before something went wrong. Before that period the oscilloscope worked perfectly fine and I really expect the problem to just go away but it didnt.

Someone mentioned this could be a NAND problem too, but I dont think so because of this: the problem gets worse the more the equipment is used.

[bsgd]

Daniel, could you please lend me some money? I believe 10.000 USD will suffice. I need to hire a lawyer to take care of some situation I'm having and since we have been 'friends' for a few days I tought maybe you could help me? 

Sorry, I just couldnt resist. People here are definitely funny.

I've got $10

Great, only 9.990 to go! 

[skipjackrc4]

I shipped the scope to California about two weeks, and it (or a replacement, I'm honestly not sure) came back today fully working.  The whole process was quite painless.

[j bob]

I have an answer to how often this happens. I have a dozen of these scopes that I got in mid 2012 (Junish) and put into service in January 2013. One had a boot failure in May of 2014. Another one had a boot failure in November of 2016.

[LA7SJA]

Firmware version on the failed units? Have they been updated?

Johan-Fredrik

[alanambrose]

Hi Daniel,

I suspect I have another example of this problem - it is an MSO-X-3024A. It was working fine, but I have not used it for a month as I've been coding firmware. It now doesn't boot - the panel LEDs flash a couple of times on power up with the Math and Ref LEDs staying on and that's it.

I'm based in UK. Does the UK contact centre have any knowledge of this problem do you think?

Regards,

Alan Ambrose

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

Hi Alan,

Definitely give the contact center a call! It's pretty painless and quick.

-Daniel

[dav]

It would be interesting to know if this problem can be fixed via the UART and/or LAN.

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

It would be interesting to know if this problem can be fixed via the UART and/or LAN.

Depending on the issue it's technically possible, but there's a lot of hacking to be done to get there. Which, of course, I don't recommend  .

[GoneOutAgain]

I recently ran into the boot issue myself back in May.  I had used the scope fairly often (many times in a month) since purchasing a couple years ago, but it had sat on the shelf for a few months when my tasking shifted.  I figured I'd post to reinforce the prevalence of the issue.  No screen output and the start/stop and single button lights stay on.  I haven't found any button it responds to except the power button.

[K1JOS]

What firmware version did you have?

Jerry

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

I'll reiterate that the new firmware releases have much better protection in place to help prevent this type of issue. There are also tens of thousands of these scopes "in the wild" so, like any electronic device, some will unfortunately have issues. However, the odds that you are the one that has an issue is very, very small.

Thanks for reaching out, let me know if you have any other questions!

Thanks,

Daniel

[dav]

The firmware I can see on Keysight website is 2.41 and is 2 years old (2015-11-02).
Is this the latest one (with protection from NAND issues) or I'm missing something?
Thanks

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

2.41 is the latest release.

[dav]

Hello Daniel, I have an Agilent 3014A.
I'm curious to know if when updating the firmware my unit will became a "Keysight" or it rests an "Agilent" (Agilent boot screen, Agilent logo on the top-right of information-area screen...). Thanks

[TheSteve]

Hello Daniel, I have an Agilent 3014A.
I'm curious to know if when updating the firmware my unit will became a "Keysight" or it rests an "Agilent" (Agilent boot screen, Agilent logo on the top-right of information-area screen...). Thanks

It will display a Keysight boot screen and show "Keysight" on the LCD.

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

Yes, the screen changes after updating. You can also upload a custom boot screen of your choosing.

[alanambrose]

>>>
Hi Daniel,

I suspect I have another example of this problem - it is an MSO-X-3024A. It was working fine, but I have not used it for a month as I've been coding firmware. It now doesn't boot - the panel LEDs flash a couple of times on power up with the Math and Ref LEDs staying on and that's it.

I'm based in UK. Does the UK contact centre have any knowledge of this problem do you think?

Regards,

Alan Ambrose
<<<

As an update to this, I contacted Keysight and the scope was fixed promptly, free of charge and with little fuss. It also came back with a fresh cal cert. Many thanks to Daniel for keeping us updated on this problem.

Alan

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

Thanks for the edit and I' glad everything's getting taken care of!

PSA, if you're having trouble with your Keysight equipment your local contact center is a great place to start. Little to no wait time and you get connected directly to an expert. I've even called them from time to time with questions.